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urout17

Balk?

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@Senor Azul, I don't believe any of us ever argued that wild throw is a balk, but a throw toward a fielder not near the base is.

And: I've had a copy since the day the 2016 book was released, as well as several older copies. I don't know what's brought upon the snarky attitude, but if there's something I can do, just let me know. This forum thrives on mutual respect of each other.

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16 hours ago, Senor Azul said:

Mr. noumpere, yes, of course, that’s what I am saying. An errant throw is not a balk. Do the terms wild throw or throws the ball away mean that it cannot be anywhere near a fielder who is not in a position to make a play or else it is a balk? Just in case you did not see my previous posts in this thread here are some unmistakable declarations from me—

Nothing in FED rule 6-2 (Infractions By Pitcher) says that a pitcher throwing a pickoff attempt away is a balk. Why do you want us to be in a position of guessing (even an educated guess) what was intended by the pitcher on the pickoff throw?

If the throw has not been caught by a fielder then it is a wild throw and a live ball.

Of course, in FED a balk is an immediate dead ball but where was it a balk before he threw the ball away?

Please note that the pitcher can throw a wild pickoff out of the field of play and it is not a balk. So why would it be a balk for a wild pickoff that stays on the field of play?

A2D.

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I think we’re over analyzing this.

1. If F3 is holding R1 on, any wild throw is not going to be a balk.

2. If F3 is not holding R1 on, and from his position on the field would not have a legitimate play on R1 even if he caught the pickoff throw, if the ball is thrown anywhere but right at the base, it’s a balk.  

3. All the rules and interps for  “a balk followed by a wild throw to a base” do not apply here. Here, the direction of the throw in and of itself  is the balk, not any illegal motion of F1 ( like a jump turn and throw  without gaining distance to 1B, LHP stepping towards home and throwing to 1b, etc.) 

its not that complicated 

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1 hour ago, Richvee said:

3. All the rules and interps for  “a balk followed by a wild throw to a base” do not apply here. Here, the direction of the throw in and of itself  is the balk, not any illegal motion of F1

You had me on your side until here.

In anything but Fed, you delay any balk award in this situation. The balk isn't really a balk until it flies over F3 (standing away from the base), so we definitely keep it alive and allow runners to advance as far as they want, protecting them only to their next base.

In Fed, you kill it immediately and give the one-base award to all runners.

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17 hours ago, yawetag said:

You had me on your side until here.

In anything but Fed, you delay any balk award in this situation. The balk isn't really a balk until it flies over F3 (standing away from the base), so we definitely keep it alive and allow runners to advance as far as they want, protecting them only to their next base.

In Fed, you kill it immediately and give the one-base award to all runners.

That's what I'm saying. So indeed we keep it live (Non FED). My only point here was, referring to rules that talk about a balk followed by a wild throw may not be relevant here. What we're talking about here isn't a balk followed by a wild throw, it's a balk because of the direction of the throw and positioning on F3. Nothing to do with the pitcher's original move from the rubber. Although the same principle does apply. It remains live. 

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