DH Rule ?

[Double Up]

Hello,  

I was recently at a tournament that allowed for both DH,  and EH in the hitting lineup.

Both were clearly listed on the batting lineup card along with a "Pitcher Only". 

After the 4th inning,  a player who was also in the batting lineup entered in to pitch. 

My question is what happens to the DH spot in the lineup?   

I'm unsure of the rules for this particular tournament, but lets say it was NFHS. 

  

[Jimurray]

1 hour ago, Double Up said:

Hello,  

I was recently at a tournament that allowed for both DH,  and EH in the hitting lineup.

Both were clearly listed on the batting lineup card along with a "Pitcher Only". 

After the 4th inning,  a player who was also in the batting lineup entered in to pitch. 

My question is what happens to the DH spot in the lineup?   

I'm unsure of the rules for this particular tournament, but lets say it was NFHS. 

  

FED:

If the “Pitcher Only” stayed on defense the DH would continue to bat for him. 

If the PO was put on the bench the DH could bat for whoever came off the bench and replaced the PO at a defensive position. There’s more but you just wanted to know what happens to that spot. The batting order never changes. 

[noumpere]

If it was OBR, then the DH is lost and whoever takes the defensive position of the player who became pitcher bats in that spot.

You can get some screwy results if it was the EH who went in to pitch -- we always hope the tournament has rules to account for that -- but they usually don't

[isired]

Most tournaments my son plays in are based on FED rules, but address DH's and EH's specifically in the house rules. If a player that is already in the lineup (other than the DH) enters to pitch, the DH is usually lost, and the incoming fielder (to replace the ppsition the new pitcher vacated) enters in the DH slot and hits, with no option to leave the DH hitting.

As for EH, they are generally treated as a position player, and can pitch or play any other position the same as any other fielder.

[Double Up]

Those explanations all make sense...    So when the PO is removed, so is the  DH,  who is replaced by the sub entering on the field. 

 

Now, what if the PO was moved over to 1B, and the original 1B is substituted for with a pitcher from the bench?   I can see now, how quickly this can turn into spaghetti.   Happy to hear all the various situations you guys care to explain. 

 

 

[Double Up]

16 hours ago, Jimurray said:

FED:

If the “Pitcher Only” stayed on defense the DH would continue to bat for him. 

If the PO was put on the bench the DH could bat for whoever came off the bench and replaced the PO at a defensive position. There’s more but you just wanted to know what happens to that spot. The batting order never changes. 

... No, Please continue.

[noumpere]

14 minutes ago, Double Up said:

Now, what if the PO was moved over to 1B, and the original 1B is substituted for with a pitcher from the bench?   I can see now, how quickly this can turn into spaghetti.   Happy to hear all the various situations you guys care to explain. 

 

 

FED:  S1 bats in place of the original F3 and DH continues to bat for original F1 (in FED, the DH can hit for any position player, not just the pitcher).

OBR: S1 bats in place of the original F3, and original F1 bats in place of the DH.  The ROLE of the DH is lost (and, in "pure" OBR, the player who was the DH is done; some tournaments / leagues allow re-entry).

[noumpere]

1 hour ago, isired said:

As for EH, they are generally treated as a position player, and can pitch or play any other position the same as any other fielder.

That's the easiest way to handle it, of course.  But, I've had plenty where that player (and any subsequent EH) could NEVER play the field, or where they could play the field, but then the EH was lost (and where the original position player's spot is skipped, and where the EH takes the position player's spot and the original EH spot is skipped -- you can see how this could lead to games playing)

[Double Up]

3 minutes ago, noumpere said:

FED:  S1 bats in place of the original F3 and DH continues to bat for original F1 (in FED, the DH can hit for any position player, not just the pitcher).

OBR: S1 bats in place of the original F3, and original F1 bats in place of the DH.  The ROLE of the DH is lost (and, in "pure" OBR, the player who was the DH is done; some tournaments / leagues allow re-entry).

Very helpful.  

[Jimurray]

2 hours ago, Double Up said:

... No, Please continue.

FED: The DH could also take a defensive position. The DH role is terminated but the player who was the DH still can be in the game. The PO would be on the bench but would have one re-entry in the player's (who was the DH) batting order slot. That player who was the DH would also have one re-entry if he was replaced by a sub.

[Double Up]

YEAH!  The Joys of HS Baseball! 

 

[Jimurray]

13 minutes ago, Double Up said:

YEAH!  The Joys of HS Baseball! 

 

As opposed to the NCAA and OBR DH rule? FED seems pretty simple compared to NCAA and OBR but usually no one pushes the envelope in NCAA and OBR so they seem simpler.

[beerguy55]

On 10/16/2018 at 5:01 PM, Double Up said:

I'm unsure of the rules for this particular tournament, but lets say it was NFHS

Of course - this is the most important piece.  The tournament rules may not fit any of the common rule sets.   I've seen tournaments that effectively blend three different rule sets, selecting the elements they like from the menu and making their own rule set that requires the umpires to do a Vulcan mind meld to know what's going on.   The coaches don't mind because they never know the rules anyway.