Jump to content

Remove these ads by becoming a Premium Member
  • 0
Sign in to follow this  
Guest Glen

Balk Rule - runner at first

Question

Guest Glen

Runner at first only.  Right-handed pitcher.  The pitcher lifts his front leg and spins toward second base and then throws to first.  Is that a balk?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

15 answers to this question

Recommended Posts

  • 0

Did he step towards second? If Yes..Then this is a balk. He cannot step to an unoccupied base. Unless.......Did R1 break towards 2B prior to the pitcher stepping to second? He is allowed to stepand fakeor throw to 2B if R1 made an attempt to advance.  If R1 was simply leading off, and the pitcher spun and stepped to 2B, (throw or no throw) we have a balk.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Remove these ads by becoming a Premium Member
  • 0
On 10/12/2018 at 6:53 PM, Richvee said:

Did he step towards second? If Yes..Then this is a balk. He cannot step to an unoccupied base. Unless.......Did R1 break towards 2B prior to the pitcher stepping to second? He is allowed to stepand fakeor throw to 2B if R1 made an attempt to advance.  If R1 was simply leading off, and the pitcher spun and stepped to 2B, (throw or no throw) we have a balk.

3

This is one of the more intricate concepts of the OBR.  I've never seen this done in a game, particularly because I imagine most everyone believes it to be a balk,  throwing to an unoccupied base despite R1 heading towards 2B.

Let's say an LHP lifts his leg,   R1 breaks on first movement...  LHP continues his motion to an inside move to 2B, legal or illegal? 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 0
3 minutes ago, Double Up said:

This is one of the more intricate concepts of the OBR.  I've never seen this done in a game, particularly because I imagine most everyone believes it to be a balk,  throwing to an unoccupied base despite R1 heading towards 2B.

Let's say an LHP lifts his leg,   R1 breaks on first movement...  LHP continues his motion to an inside move to 2B, legal or illegal? 

 

 

 

Legal, of course.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 0
1 hour ago, Double Up said:

This is one of the more intricate concepts of the OBR.  I've never seen this done in a game, particularly because I imagine most everyone believes it to be a balk, 

 

 

 

I had it at 3B to end a game....

R2, 2 outs, last inning team AB down a run. RHP comes set. R2 breaks for 3rd. (I don't know why). F1 steps, throws to 3B, out by 20 feet. Game over. 

...Let $h*t show commence...Coaches, parents, players, all going nuts..."You don't know the rules, you're the worst umpire ever"...all the fun stuff..2 post game ejections followed, and 2 parents following us to the cars. Closest I ever came to having to call the police. 

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 0
2 hours ago, Richvee said:

I had it at 3B to end a game....

R2, 2 outs, last inning team AB down a run. RHP comes set. R2 breaks for 3rd. (I don't know why). F1 steps, throws to 3B, out by 20 feet. Game over. 

...Let $h*t show commence...Coaches, parents, players, all going nuts..."You don't know the rules, you're the worst umpire ever"...all the fun stuff..2 post game ejections followed, and 2 parents following us to the cars. Closest I ever came to having to call the police. 

Hilarious!! Just goes to show how completely ignorant 99% of all the spectators are when it comes to the rules.    Most peoples versions of the rulebook have been handed down through old wives tales and miscommunication from their LL coaches. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 0
15 hours ago, Double Up said:

Hilarious!! Just goes to show how completely ignorant 99% of all the spectators

And a good percentage of the umpires -- including some who post here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 0
On 10/17/2018 at 12:33 PM, noumpere said:

Legal, of course.

 

Please come to the umpire rooms where I umpire...

I was in the field, and runner breaks for second (still on sure if it was the fact that it was young players, or if it was the coach pulling some Bush stuff in a blow out), prompting the pitcher to do an inside move. In between innings, my partner told me I'd missed a balk on the inside move (??? call it then?) , citing the throw to an unoccupied base. I was 90% I was right, and told him as much. In between that game and the next, I asked all of the other umpires at the part of the complex (probably 8 or so) and all of them agreed that it was a balk. Came back the next night with rule reference in hand, still couldn't convince any of them. 

Kinda shocks me. Some of them know the rules pretty well, and, at least for a rec league, they're generally pretty good umpires. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 0
4 hours ago, Biscuit said:

Some of them know the rules pretty well, and, at least for a rec league, they're generally pretty good umpires.

Apparently not. This is pretty basic, even for rec ball.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 0
58 minutes ago, maven said:

Apparently not. This is pretty basic, even for rec ball.

Yeah, it shocks me. I’ve heard some pretty intricate rules disscussions... really shook my faith in my rules knowledge until I looked it up. 

  • Confused 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 0

From the 2018 Minor League Baseball Umpire Manual (section 6.22, p. 104):

“Official Baseball Rule 6.02(a)(4) provides that the pitcher be charged with a balk if, while in contact with the rubber, he throws to an unoccupied base except for the purpose of making a play.

Play 1:  Runners on first and second, pitcher in set position. Runner breaks for third base and pitcher throws to third base.

Ruling 1:  Legal play.

Play 2:  Runners on first and second, pitcher in set position. Runner bluffs going to third base and pitcher throws to third base. However, runner did not go.

Ruling 2:  Balk under Official Baseball Rule 6.02(a)(4).

“The key to understanding the above two plays is for the umpire to use good judgment in deciding whether or not the runner on the previous base demonstrates or otherwise creates an impression of his intent to advance to such unoccupied base…”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 0

From the 2013 Wendelstedt Rules and Interpretations Manual (p. 105):

“The determination of whether a pitcher is making a play is the judgment of the umpires. If a pitcher throws or feints to an unoccupied base because he believes the runner is attempting to steal that base, but the runner only took a few steps in that direction and stops; this is not making a legitimate play on the runner and should be called a balk. If the pitcher throws or feints to an unoccupied second base when a runner attempts to steal that base, no balk should be called, even if the runner stops and returns or gets into a rundown.”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 0
24 minutes ago, Senor Azul said:

From the 2013 Wendelstedt Rules and Interpretations Manual (p. 105):

“The determination of whether a pitcher is making a play is the judgment of the umpires. If a pitcher throws or feints to an unoccupied base because he believes the runner is attempting to steal that base, but the runner only took a few steps in that direction and stops; this is not making a legitimate play on the runner and should be called a balk. If the pitcher throws or feints to an unoccupied second base when a runner attempts to steal that base, no balk should be called, even if the runner stops and returns or gets into a rundown.”

That’s from 2013. I think a later interp allows for giving the impression or something like that. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 0

Do you mean like in my first post from the 2018 MiBUM?-- The key to understanding the above two plays is for the umpire to use good judgment in deciding whether or not the runner on the previous base demonstrates or otherwise creates an impression of his intent to advance to such unoccupied base (emphasis added)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
You are commenting as a guest. If you have an account, please sign in.
Answer this question...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×