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humanbackstop19

Force play slide INT video

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19 minutes ago, humanbackstop19 said:

Anybody have force play slide interference here?  This play ended a State semifinal in Iowa with the tying run on second base at the time of the pitch.  

 

https://twitter.com/KWhiteOWH/status/1022915170761420800?s=03)

 

 

 

 

 

 

At first I thought it was a slide directly into the base but it appears the fielder actually stepped to the outfield side of the bag and the runner bent at the waist to contact the fielder.

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Looks legal to me from this angle.

We need to officiate the entire play, not the outcome.

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Looks like a good slide to me.

 

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10 minutes ago, umpstu said:

Looks like a good slide to me.

 

We need a better angle but it looks like the fielder was outside of the unprotected zone and was contacted there by the runner’s torso. I believe NCAA guidance wording is that the entire body must slide in a direct line to the base. If the fielder was in a protected area and there was contact there it was not a legal slide. 

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I've got a clean slide. Especially in real time. Feet on the ground, directly into the bag. Does he turn his torso a little after the initial slide? Yeah, maybe... when F4 is falling on him.

If I watch it 15 times, slow it down, watch it a few more times, maybe I can nitpick some part of R1's actions. Nothing I'll ever catch live at full speed.

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2 hours ago, Jimurray said:

At first I thought it was a slide directly into the base but it appears the fielder actually stepped to the outfield side of the bag and the runner bent at the waist to contact the fielder.

I've a fielder stepping directly in a line from 2B to 1B - Right into a sliding R1 sliding directly into 2B.

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16 minutes ago, Richvee said:

I've a fielder stepping directly in a line from 2B to 1B - Right into a sliding R1 sliding directly into 2B.

The runners feet go directly to the bag. Why didn't the feet take out the fielder if you say he stepped directly to 1B. The fielder stepped at an angle toward RF and 1B and was in his protected area. The runners torso which did not go in a straight line to the bag made contact with the fielder in his protected area.

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I’m finding nothing illegal with that slide.

To boot: presume that’s a 3/4 man crew, U2 looks like he could be in a little better position????


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8 minutes ago, Jimurray said:

The runners feet go directly to the bag. Why didn't the feet take out the fielder if you say he stepped directly to 1B.

The fielder's feet in front of 2B, in a line towards 2B, on the outer third of the 2B. R1's feet do not contact the fielder, I give you that.

The fielder stepped at an angle toward RF and 1B and was in his protected area.

I don't think he steps towards RF at all. I've got both feet in line between 1B and 2B within the width of the bag.

The runners torso which did not go in a straight line to the bag made contact with the fielder in his protected area.

It's tough to tell, but it looks to me that the fielder is falling into R1 prior to contact with R1's torso. My best guess is the fielder tripped on R1's bent leg.

And I still contend the fielder is planted in R1's sliding lane.

If F6 was  noticeably outside the the width of the bag planted and throwing ,I'd agree with you 100%. I don't have him outside (to the RF side) of the bag at all from this view.

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1 hour ago, Jimurray said:

The runners feet go directly to the bag. Why didn't the feet take out the fielder if you say he stepped directly to 1B.

I don't make INT/FPSR calls based on inferences. I see a legal slide here from the angle given. That answers the question in the OP.

Frankly, FPSR will need to be obvious from the angle given in order properly to be called. When in doubt, the slide is legal.

We need to call what we see, not what we infer might have possibly happened under some constraining hypothetical presuppositions.

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I have a legal slide. The fielder is in front of the bag, not to the side, and not in a protected area. The res of the slide is legal as well. 

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Nothing to call here except the out. Defensive coach will come out to argue.

Bob: "He ran into my fielder. He can't do that." Me: "Bob, the slide was legal. He had one leg and one buttock on the ground and went directly into the bag. Bob: "But he made contact with my fielder." Me: "I know Bob, there was contact, but it was legal contact. We have a legal slide into the bag. Although contact was made, it was because  your fielder  was in front of the bag. Your fielder is not protected in front of the bag." Bob: "Well you're right as usual. I'll just go back to the dugout now."

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27 minutes ago, Forest Ump said:

Nothing to call here except the out. Defensive coach will come out to argue.

Bob: "He ran into my fielder. He can't do that." Me: "Bob, the slide was legal. He had one leg and one buttock on the ground and went directly into the bag. Bob: "But he made contact with my fielder." Me: "I know Bob, there was contact, but it was legal contact. We have a legal slide into the bag. Although contact was made, it was because  your fielder  was in front of the bag. Your fielder is not protected in front of the bag." Bob: "Well you're right as usual. I'll just go back to the dugout now."

Actually, whether the runner had have one buttock on the ground when he hit the bag might be debatable. Whether the fielder was in front of the bag needs another angle. A previous poster said U2 was not in a good position. That's true. 

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1 hour ago, maven said:

I don't make INT/FPSR calls based on inferences. I see a legal slide here from the angle given. That answers the question in the OP.

Frankly, FPSR will need to be obvious from the angle given in order properly to be called. When in doubt, the slide is legal.

We need to call what we see, not what we infer might have possibly happened under some constraining hypothetical presuppositions.

I don't think from what I have read that the calling umpire inferred anything. He was not in a good position, and might actually have applied the rule wrongly.  But I am not inferring anything. I might call FPSR INT on this play if I was in proper position and saw what you think I was inferring. NCAA has some interesting videos of this type of play.

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3 hours ago, Jimurray said:

The runners feet go directly to the bag. Why didn't the feet take out the fielder if you say he stepped directly to 1B. The fielder stepped at an angle toward RF and 1B and was in his protected area. The runners torso which did not go in a straight line to the bag made contact with the fielder in his protected area.

Just from watching this clip a million times I've got a good slide.  Wish there were other views, like that MC.

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2018 FED Case Book Play 2.32.1 SITUATION: 

With R1, a ground ball is hit to F6, who throws to F4 covering second. R1 slides late at second, stays in the baseline, but R1 makes contact with F4 who is in front of the base, causing him to overthrow first base. RULING:  Providing the slide is legal and the contact is not malicious, there is no violation.

2018 FED Case Book Play 5.1.1 Situation O:  With R1, a ground ball is hit to F6, who throws to F4 covering second. R1 slides late at second, stays in the baseline, but R1 makes contact with F4 in front of the base, causing him to overthrow first base. RULING:  Providing the slide is legal and the contact is not malicious, there is no violation. (2-32-2f)

 

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If you read down the "tweets", some get quite entertaining (sorry, I was at a loss for words).  But it did make me think about how many people THINK they know the rules.  You hear it almost every day at every ball field, in the dugout, the stands, hell...............even the announcers.  If we could get all of those folks assigned to games, there wouldn't be an umpire shortage for the next 40-50 years!

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13 hours ago, Forest Ump said:

Nothing to call here except the out. Defensive coach will come out to argue.

Bob: "He ran into my fielder. He can't do that." Me: "Bob, the slide was legal. He had one leg and one buttock on the ground and went directly into the bag. Bob: "But he made contact with my fielder." Me: "I know Bob, there was contact, but it was legal contact. We have a legal slide into the bag. Although contact was made, it was because  your fielder  was in front of the bag. Your fielder is not protected in front of the bag." Bob: "Well you're right as usual. I'll just go back to the dugout now."

Wow, that's pretty wordy.

 

How about, "Bob, I've got the runner legal, "But he made contact with my fielder," Bob, I've got the runner legal." " Let's play ball."

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13 hours ago, Forest Ump said:

Nothing to call here except the out. Defensive coach will come out to argue.

Bob: "He ran into my fielder. He can't do that." Me: "Bob, the slide was legal. He had one leg and one buttock on the ground and went directly into the bag. Bob: "But he made contact with my fielder." Me: "I know Bob, there was contact, but it was legal contact. We have a legal slide into the bag. Although contact was made, it was because  your fielder  was in front of the bag. Your fielder is not protected in front of the bag." Bob: "You need to learn the rules!"

In red is the response more likely to be spoken by the coach as he is walking away.  LOL

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9 hours ago, lawump said:

In red is the response more likely to be spoken by the coach as he is walking away.  LOL

Hey, I can dream, right?:P

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