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stkjock

Ball Under or Lodged in Offensive Players Uniform

Question

I searched the board first and didn't see this topic covered, though I'm sure it has been covered at some point.

Say under OBR

 

Pickoff at first, not caught by F3, no one sees the ball, ball is either:

 

1) Lodged in R1s jersey

 

2) Under R1s body

 

What would be the ruling?

 

 

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19 minutes ago, stkjock said:

I searched the board first and didn't see this topic covered, though I'm sure it has been covered at some point.

Say under OBR

 

Pickoff at first, not caught by F3, no one sees the ball, ball is either:

 

1) Lodged in R1s jersey

 

2) Under R1s body

 

What would be the ruling?

 

 

 

Balled lodged in uniform will be dead and awarded based on pitchers actions prior to pickoff 

Under his body is not lodged but cannot intentionally interfere, can't lay there while all teammates run forever 

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Umpire judgment if the ball goes into a player's or coach's uniform.  It doesn't matter whether it's the offense or defense (it makes a difference in FED).

If the player continues to lie on the ball, I'd consider that to be willful and deliberate interference.

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16 minutes ago, noumpere said:

Umpire judgment if the ball goes into a player's or coach's uniform.  It doesn't matter whether it's the offense or defense (it makes a difference in FED).

If the player continues to lie on the ball, I'd consider that to be willful and deliberate interference.

so lodged, award one base?

 

if lying on the ball - call time INT, return any runners to base TOT?

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3 minutes ago, stkjock said:

so lodged, award one base?

 

if lying on the ball - call time INT, return any runners to base TOT?

1) No.  'Whatever would have happened"

2) Get an out,; return TOI.

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Before you grab that out... you better be sure his actions are willful and deliberate. If he is just laying there and then gets up, you have nothing.

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37 minutes ago, BT_Blue said:

Before you grab that out... you better be sure his actions are willful and deliberate. If he is just laying there and then gets up, you have nothing.

Which is why I said, " If the player continues to lie on the ball, I'd consider that to be willful and deliberate interference.

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'Whatever would have happened"
We had a situation a couple of weeks ago - R1 & R2, no count, no out. Pitcher delivers a pitch in the dirt. Neither R is stealing. Catcher blocks the pitch, and ball gets between him and his chest protector. After a brief moment of not realizing where it was (let's say 3-4 seconds, but it was certainly less than that), he reached in and grabs the ball. The runners did a little 'should I or shouldn't I' dance, but never got more than a step or two further than their secondary lead, and came back to their base. Seemed pretty uneventful until PU awarded both runners a base because the ball became lodged in the catcher's equipment.

 

Your comment above makes me think that he shouldn't have awarded the base - the runners certainly would not have advanced on that pitch if the ball didn't get lodged, they were only considering it because it did, and both decided against it quickly. Rule set is OBR as far as this goes.

 

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"lodged in equipment" (or between equipment and uniform) is NOT the same as "enters a player's uniform"
OK - it was between his Jersey and chest protector. So they called it right? As soon as I saw it I said 'they're going to give the runners a base' - nobody questioned it, I thought it was absolute at the time - the wording above is what made me question it.

So is pretty much anything except the uniform considered equipment? For example:
I assume the glove is equipment, correct? If the ball is stuck in the webbing of the glove, do you award a base?

What if it's F5's glove, would an R2 be awarded 3B, even if F5 could have still legally tagged him out if he had actually tried to advance?

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5 minutes ago, isired said:


I assume the glove is equipment, correct? If the ball is stuck in the webbing of the glove, do you award a base?

 

That's "play on" except in FED which awards two bases.

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3 minutes ago, noumpere said:

That's "play on" except in FED which awards two bases.

I believe it is "play on" until the fielder removes the glove from his hand... ie to toss it to first to make the put out. 

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1 minute ago, BT_Blue said:

I believe it is "play on" until the fielder removes the glove from his hand... ie to toss it to first to make the put out. 

I was taking "lodged" as a given -- but what you say is one way we determine it's lodged.

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The first question is - what if you don't know?

OP says "no one sees the ball"...so, you don't know if the ball is under the player or lodged in F3 shirt.  It's even possible that either player doesn't know right away. ie. they can't feel the ball in their shirt or underneath them

Are you calling time at some point to figure out where the ball is - or letting the "play" continue until we figure out where the ball is?  You know it's there somewhere....it didnt' disappear and it didn't go into the dugout, and this isn't hockey where the ref blows the whistle when he loses sight of the puck.

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At some point (fairly early on) the runner will stand up -- if for no other reason than to be ready to advance if the ball is really away and it's not some trick play by the defense.

Keep it live.

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2 hours ago, BT_Blue said:

I believe it is "play on" until the fielder removes the glove from his hand... ie to toss it to first to make the put out. 

In OBR that's a valid play so it's play on in OBR

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