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johnnyg08

Catcher Interference - Coach Takes the Result

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Any insight on what the DHC could have asked that prompted the 2nd conference?

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Good question. Been trying to figure that out as well. Maybe he was going back out there to compliment the crew on getting the play correct. "Jeff, Billy...I just wanted to get you two over here to say nice job and I'm glad you're out here today." :D

 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, KenBAZ said:

Any insight on what the DHC could have asked that prompted the 2nd conference?

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Lack of confidence in the rule implementation. I would say that it appears at the NCAA level they require the coach to know he can get the penalty or the play. Or the PU did not know he could offer the choice which is why he had to conference.

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I just saw this vid on YT and was going to post it.  Good example of a uncommon play 

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I'd guess he wanted R2 returned to 2B. Hey, it can't hurt to ask!

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2 hours ago, Jimurray said:

Lack of confidence in the rule implementation. I would say that it appears at the NCAA level they require the coach to know he can get the penalty or the play. Or the PU did not know he could offer the choice which is why he had to conference.

I think the umpire knew what he was doing in the play. If you watch him, he never kills the ball, he just keeps pointing to signal he had the interference.

I think the conference was where to place the runners. Looks to me that they got it correct.

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NCAA we enforce the CI and the coach needs to know his options.  The second conference was b/c the DHC wanted to protest and since it's post season that gets the CC involved.  The CC in this case talked the coach out of his protest. The call is 100% accurate.

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1 minute ago, hckyosgood30 said:

NCAA we enforce the CI and the coach needs to know his options.  The second conference was b/c the DHC wanted to protest and since it's post season that gets the CC involved.  The CC in this case talked the coach out of his protest. The call is 100% accurate.

Good info on the 2nd conference. Makes total sense. Thanks for chiming in! 

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1 hour ago, hckyosgood30 said:

NCAA we enforce the CI and the coach needs to know his options.  The second conference was b/c the DHC wanted to protest and since it's post season that gets the CC involved.  The CC in this case talked the coach out of his protest. The call is 100% accurate.

What do you suppose the first conference was for?  My best guess is that it was to verify that R3 had scored and R2 advanced to third when the BR was thrown out at first.

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I agree the 1st conference was most likely to get information to place the runners. I also can believe the 2nd conference was based on a request to protest but was the DHC going to admit he didn't know the offense had an option there? Maybe he questioned how long it took for the OHC to ask for the result of the play? BTW, I loved the HPU's command and unmistakable mechanics.

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Interesting strategy; I think I'd have a hard time giving up bases loaded and 1 out in the first inning to trade a run for an out.  

My guess is the first conference was to make sure no one killed the play prematurely and to accurately place runners.  

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Is U1 mechanic correct? Calling time and not signaling an out?

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17 hours ago, Richvee said:

Is U1 mechanic correct? Calling time and not signaling an out?

Not much guidance in the rule book. There is this:

"5-3-d.    Batter-runner is obstructed before reaching first base. There are three situations to consider:
1) Batter-runner is obstructed on a ground ball to an infielder.
PENALTY—The ball is dead and the batter-runner is awarded first base."

Which you would think would not include CI but CI is referenced in the definitions under Obstruction. But it also conflicts with the rule regarding "if the batter reaches 1B".

Common sense would seem to be let it play out and let the calling umpire, the PU, kill it when appropriate. That may be what the DHC was asking. Was it dead before the runner scored? It would not have been pretty if F3 backpicked at 3B and the throw was wild.

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On 6/10/2017 at 1:28 PM, hckyosgood30 said:

NCAA we enforce the CI and the coach needs to know his options.  The second conference was b/c the DHC wanted to protest and since it's post season that gets the CC involved.  The CC in this case talked the coach out of his protest. The call is 100% accurate.

That might be a change. Carl Childress quotes Bible and Williams Allen as advising to offer the option to the coach in NCAA.

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On 6/10/2017 at 10:05 AM, Jimurray said:

Lack of confidence in the rule implementation. I would say that it appears at the NCAA level they require the coach to know he can get the penalty or the play. Or the PU did not know he could offer the choice which is why he had to conference.

it is NOT a lack of rules knowledge on the part of the HP umpire as he is one of the best in the country.

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On 6/10/2017 at 1:28 PM, hckyosgood30 said:

NCAA we enforce the CI and the coach needs to know his options.  The second conference was b/c the DHC wanted to protest and since it's post season that gets the CC involved.  The CC in this case talked the coach out of his protest. The call is 100% accurate.

I highly doubt that he wanted to protest ( unless you heard from one of the crew members.)

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39 minutes ago, Haid D' Salaami said:

it is NOT a lack of rules knowledge on the part of the HP umpire as he is one of the best in the country.

I would think he is. He definitely knew where the runners got to because he pointed them back to their original base. But in a high stakes game he conferenced possibly to insure the "time" call didn't affect the other runners advance?

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18 hours ago, Jimurray said:

I would think he is. He definitely knew where the runners got to because he pointed them back to their original base. But in a high stakes game he conferenced possibly to insure the "time" call didn't affect the other runners advance?

the advanced of runners is not gonna matter.. because ALL runners and batter runner did not advance a base safely.  Sometimes its great to confer with the crew to triple check we are applying the correct rule, and placing runners at the right base.

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46 minutes ago, Haid D' Salaami said:

the advanced of runners is not gonna matter.. because ALL runners and batter runner did not advance a base safely.  Sometimes its great to confer with the crew to triple check we are applying the correct rule, and placing runners at the right base.

Yes, but as @Richvee asks, what is the protocol for killing the play? Who kills the play? Should U1 just signal the out because at that point we don't know if F3 is done and won't attempt further action although it became obvious almost right away.

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Curious as to why the PU didn't ask the coach before putting runners back on their original bases, could have saved a lot of time. What IS the correct mechanic?

 

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17 minutes ago, Tborze said:

Curious as to why the PU didn't ask the coach before putting runners back on their original bases, could have saved a lot of time. What IS the correct mechanic?

 

I can't speak for NCAA, but you let the play finish in its entirety. Then, if all the runners and the BR didn't advance one base safely, enforce the CI. All runners return TOP and the BR is awarded first base. Runners only advance if forced by the BR. Then, if the coach wants to elect the result of the play, he'll notify PU accordingly. 

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2 minutes ago, Stk004 said:

I can't speak for NCAA, but you let the play finish in its entirety. Then, if all the runners and the BR didn't advance one base safely, enforce the CI. All runners return TOP and the BR is awarded first base. Runners only advance if forced by the BR. Then, if the coach wants to elect the result of the play, he'll notify PU accordingly. 

At all (?)  youth leagues, up through HS, ask the coach if he want's the "play or the penalty."  Enforce accordingly.

In MiLB and MLB, just enforce the penalty and make the coach ask for the play.

I always used the first of the above in the college games I did (it never came up, that I recall, in any of the D-1 games).  According to at least one poster in this thread, college (at some level) is now treated as the second of the above.

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One of my favorite stories told by a former MiLB umpire was an instance where a run scored on an instance of CI.

As he was enforcing the penalty and instructing the runner to leave the dugout and return to his TOP base, the coach came out looking very uncomfortable and said, according to the story teller, something along the lines of "Hey, didn't he score?"  The umpire said "There was CI on the play, and since the BR did not reach first base safely, I'm enforcing the penalty."  The coach, looking even more uncomfortable and even a little bit desperate, said, "But... isn't there a thing... if the run scored...  I thought...  we could keep it...  or something..."  And the umpire, enjoying every second, waited until the coach ran out of words, looked at his sad face, and asked, "Mike, are you saying you want to take the option here?"  He said the relief that washed over the coach's face almost made him laugh out loud.

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