Obviously dumb. But is it illegal?

[Guest Guest]

Pitcher engages mound in stretch. Comes set legally. Then goes into a full windup from the set position and pitches. Obviously any intelligent baserunner would take off for second base as soon as he started his "windup" but is this a balk? 

[Rich Ives]

2 minutes ago, Guest Guest said:

Pitcher engages mound in stretch. Comes set legally. Then goes into a full windup from the set position and pitches. Obviously any intelligent baserunner would take off for second base as soon as he started his "windup" but is this a balk? 

Depends on the rules. In LL majors and below it's a legal move.

[Guest Guest (OP)]

Sorry this is in a 90 foot field with OBR rules. 13-14 year old kids just learning how to pitch from the stretch and hold runners on etc

[MadMax]

4 hours ago, Guest Guest said:

Pitcher engages mound in stretch. Comes set legally. Then goes into a full windup from the set position and pitches.

Complete with a step back, pivot and the whole shebang? Technically, yes it is a balk. Have umpires let that go before, cognizant of the context / circumstances (13U "Learner ball")? If runners aren't being deceived / picked off / thrown out, and we don't have a no-pitch, then yes, umpires have let those slide.

As said, though, technically, it is a balk. A step towards a base – which a full windup usually entails – without a throw to that base or a legal disengagement is a balk. If this is competitive 13U ball, they should have learned and practiced this in 12U 50-70 baseball. If this is "Learner ball", I would be more lenient in regards to explanations. The balk would have to be called, but I would allow a coach to step from the dugout (not cross the chalk, unless he wants a charged conference) and guide/coach the F1 as to what he did wrong and how to fix it. With the ball dead, if the F1 wants to try it and get my approval, a simple "Yup, that works" or "No, not right yet" will suffice. I certainly won't go out to the mound and explain it to him, nor will I demonstrate something in any way.

[noumpere]

I seem to recall that Wendelstadt (and maybe others) have this as legal -- precisely for the reason mentioned:  The runner is going to advance on a steal anyway.

[GPblue]

Game management.....Don't punish the dumb??

[pnewton]

Would this not be covered in OBR by the new "hybrid stance" ruling that the pitcher must declare they will wind up from what looks like a set position?

[BrianC14]

30 minutes ago, pnewton said:

Would this not be covered in OBR by the new "hybrid stance" ruling that the pitcher must declare they will wind up from what looks like a set position?

I think that the hybrid thing is more specifically about foot position.  Reading the OP, it appears that F1 was actually combining the set 'stop' and then (somehow) doing a full windup after the stop.  

[Jimurray]

51 minutes ago, noumpere said:

I seem to recall that Wendelstadt (and maybe others) have this as legal -- precisely for the reason mentioned:  The runner is going to advance on a steal anyway.

Yes but now he has to tell the runner and umps that he is going to windup. To give them few milliseconds more jump.