60 Seconds

[zoops]

Myself and a couple other umpires were talking about the FED rule of 5 warm up pitches between innings completed in 1 minute, timed from the 3rd out.  Does anyone enforce this?  Even in NCAA games it is rare for a pitcher to complete his 5 throws in a minute timed from when all defenders cross the foul line.   Just seems like an unrealistic rule and one that puts an umpire in a tough spot if you do get a team that is being slow, since even a team that does hustle is going to have a hard time not violating the rule.  

[udbrky]

I've started stressing to the coaches hustling in and our pregame and it's helped. I don't pull out a stopwatch, but if they're dragging, tell the catcher fewer pitches. 

[zm1283]

2 hours ago, zoops said:

Myself and a couple other umpires were talking about the FED rule of 5 warm up pitches between innings completed in 1 minute, timed from the 3rd out.  Does anyone enforce this?  Even in NCAA games it is rare for a pitcher to complete his 5 throws in a minute timed from when all defenders cross the foul line.   Just seems like an unrealistic rule and one that puts an umpire in a tough spot if you do get a team that is being slow, since even a team that does hustle is going to have a hard time not violating the rule.  

NCAA is 90 seconds from when the defense leaves the field. Most teams make it pretty easily. 

In my experience, high school teams/players fart around way more than college teams do. You really have to work to keep the game moving, more so than a college game a lot of the time. 

[ALStripes17]

Yes it's enforced. Get the game moving. It's amazing how quickly a pitcher/catcher will be out there next inning when the pitcher only gets 2 or 3 warmups previously due to taking his jolly sweet time

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[maineump]

Keep them from 'meeting' in front of the dugout before going onto the field. Sometimes just a quick reminder to the coach about the warm-up time.

Colleges do a very good job of meeting their time limits, as the defense hustles onto the field. Even when the catcher is caught on base, there is always someone out there to warm up the pitcher.

Take a stop watch out and check it, maybe they will get the hint.

[RichMSN]

Also, don't allow a mound meeting after the first inning. Amazing how that can get things going quicker.

[zm1283]

3 hours ago, maineump said:

Keep them from 'meeting' in front of the dugout before going onto the field. Sometimes just a quick reminder to the coach about the warm-up time.

Colleges do a very good job of meeting their time limits, as the defense hustles onto the field. Even when the catcher is caught on base, there is always someone out there to warm up the pitcher.

Take a stop watch out and check it, maybe they will get the hint.

As long as the pitcher comes out and starts warming up, I don't care if the rest of them meet in front of the dugout. They don't have to warm up before the inning. They just need to be ready when the inning starts. 

[catsbackr]

Time technically starts after last defensive player crosses foul line.  Field ump gets to right field, walks to A after 45 seconds, let's plate ump know throw needs to go down.  Pretty easy really.

[ALStripes17]

Time technically starts after last defensive player crosses foul line.  Field ump gets to right field, walks to A after 45 seconds, let's plate ump know throw needs to go down.  Pretty easy really.

FED starts the 60 seconds from when the 3rd out is made.

And BU shouldn't be telling me anything from RF (nor walking) unless I am preoccupied with substitutions or other management matters.

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[zoops]

3 hours ago, ALStripes17 said:

FED starts the 60 seconds from when the 3rd out is made.

And BU shouldn't be telling me anything from RF (nor walking) unless I am preoccupied with substitutions or other management matters.

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You carry a stopwatch when you're PU?  Kept an eye on this during my NCAA game today, I think there was 1 half inning where the team would have been able to throw 5 warmup pitches in a minute timed from the 3rd out of the previous half inning, they certainly weren't lollygagging, and both pitchers were being DH'd for.  The FED requirement just seems unreasonable, I think the NCAA requirement would be more appropriate.  That said, I know of no one locally that enforces it and it never comes up in state meetings or anything, so whatever I guess.  

[ALStripes17]

You carry a stopwatch when you're PU?  Kept an eye on this during my NCAA game today, I think there was 1 half inning where the team would have been able to throw 5 warmup pitches in a minute timed from the 3rd out of the previous half inning, they certainly weren't lollygagging, and both pitchers were being DH'd for.  The FED requirement just seems unreasonable, I think the NCAA requirement would be more appropriate.  That said, I know of no one locally that enforces it and it never comes up in state meetings or anything, so whatever I guess.  

I don't carry a stopwatch for FED games but it's amazing how much faster my battery gets out there after they lollygag one inning and only get 3 warmups. We all have a routine. You can find a minute very easily.

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[Thunderheads]

60 seconds when the 3rd out is made?  Please ........

[catsbackr]

HS, time starts at third out.  I stand corrected.

[ALStripes17]

60 seconds when the 3rd out is made?  Please ........

Rarely an issue but majority of the time your F1 and F2 are not on the bases or batting so it's easy for them to get out there and get going. A lot of my games have F2 ready to throw it down as the fielders finish assuming their positions (very few infield warmups, if any).

Again, I don't carry a stopwatch to FED games but I am sure as heck not going to stand around and let some of those jokers take their jolly sweet time.

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[zoops]

I certainly agree and do cut down on warm up pitches if teams are being slow.  If a coach were to make a stink about you not allowing his pitcher enough warm ups (in his mind) and you have to tell him the rule, now you're kind of locked in to enforcing the rule and you're going to look like a redass if you're actually holding teams to the 60 second limit.  It would be nice if the rule was something that could be realistically enforced.  I'm probably preaching to the choir here...

[johnnyg08]

I enforce it, but just shy of a stopwatch.  It can be done.  The rule is written clearly as well.  I think it's great and it does keep the game moving.

 

[ZebraStripes]

When they lollygag, I take pitches away.  I had the first game of a 5 inning double header and one team had the full allotment of pitches once in the game.  And twice in the double header.

[Cav]

NFHS' concern about and rules to control pace of play: Counting warmup pitches; 7-3-1 Getting and keeping the batter in the box; 30-minute lightning rule; 5-2-1-b-1 30-minute weather and field condition rule; 6-2-2c 20-second between pitches and 1-minute for warmups rule; Speed up rules; et. al.  They all seem so precise and well intended yet there is no requirement to carry a timepiece or an abundance of fields with clocks. 

As a BU, I inform my plate man that I count the warm ups and also keep a stop watch.  He can do what he will with the info that I signal to him.  On the plate, I expect my partners to count pitches and I encourage them to use a stop watch as I do.  I do take away warm ups as necessary.  

That said, I don't get paid by the hour and, as I approach the twilight of this avocation of mine, I do enjoy working a game, so I'm not really all that put off on games going long.  I am when coaches and kids don't hustle on and off, sometimes casting the perception that they really don't want to be there.  If they don't, then neither do I. 

Making up 15 - 30 seconds, or more sometimes, between halves adds up to several minutes during a contest.  During a good game I can handle that; during most of my games, not so much.  

  

 

 

[Minnz]

On 5/1/2016 at 4:36 PM, ALStripes17 said:

FED starts the 60 seconds from when the 3rd out is made.

And BU shouldn't be telling me anything from RF (nor walking) unless I am preoccupied with substitutions or other management matters.

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WHAT? Your BU shouldn't tell you anything fro RF? How else do you keep track of time since the BU has the timing and stopwatch.

[ALStripes17]

WHAT? Your BU shouldn't tell you anything fro RF? How else do you keep track of time since the BU has the timing and stopwatch.

FED mechanics have BU with a stopwatch?

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[Umpire in Chief]

This is an essential element of game management. In my HS association we would get dinged in an evaluation. 

[VolUmp]

I think there's a middle ground here.

Even if you understand the unreasonable limit is 60 seconds, but you NEVER let it go past 90 seconds, that's suddenly very reasonable.

Umps who pay no attention to this routinely let 3 full minutes go between half innings.

One thing I always call for is a backup catcher when the catcher was caught on base.

If they don't respond with one, then I take pitches away -- even if that means, "Throw down, Catch!" on the first pitch.

[lawump]

I am speaking as an umpire, not as a rules committee member.  (I wasn't even on the committee when the "60-second" rule was enacted).

I don't time 60-seconds in a FED game.  (Yes, I time 90-seconds in NCAA when I'm the base umpire.)  If the battery (or F1 and a bench player (because F2 is getting his gear on)) comes out quickly and the pitcher is throwing his warm-up pitches with a decent pace between warm-up tosses...then I don't worry about the 60-seconds.  If the pitcher comes out, the catcher is getting his gear on, and no one comes out to warm-up the pitcher...then I give a quick shout out to the dugout.  If they don't have someone hustle out immediately...then I take away warm-up pitches.

My point is this: If you count the number of warm-up pitches and tell the pitcher, "last one!" after he has thrown four...then your games will not be slowed in any meaningful way.