They Always Eject Themselves!

[BillKen]

Second round varsity playoff game last night..game tied 3-3 in the top of the 7th, (4-man crew) we had a rundown between 3B & HP and the runner made a great dive back into the bag at 3B and the defender missed on the swipe tag.  Both defensive coaches came out of the dugout to argue with my U3...I made a beeline to the assistant to get him off my partner.  I had warned him in the 2nd for arguing balls/strikes from the 1B coaches box...and I had sent him to the dugout when he came out in the 5th to try and discuss a ball off the batter's foot.  So this incident was his 3rd time to interact with me (twice too many for an assistant coach but it was a playoff game and I really didn't want to eject a coach in that situation).  As I was walking him back to the dugout, he continued to argue.  I raised my voice to a commanding level and said "Get in the dugout."  He went to the edge and picked up a chair over his head and slammed it into the back wall of the dugout.  DONE!  Glad he made it easy on me...he looks really bad on paper...3 warnings prior to him losing his mind.

[Tksjewelry]

He threw a chair!? Yeah, he's a great influence for those HS kids. buhbye coach. 

[blue23ll]

Been watching too much WWE. The assistant probably should have been sent to the parking lot vs the bench after arguing the ball off the foot. Nothing good ever results if you let the inmates run the asylum. 

Edited May 17, 2015 by blue23ll

[tjwoelfel13]

He hopefully will have a nice suspension to calm down over. 

[BillKen]

His season ended when his team lost.  His #1 problem is that his HC is weak so he has been in charge of the team all season (it appeared like that to me).  If the HC takes control of him early, none of it has to happen.

 

[catsbackr]

Why would you allow an asst. Coach to interact with the umpires 2 other times before ejecting?  By rule, if they leave their coaches box to argue a call, they're gone.

[woodiemiller]

Second round varsity playoff game last night..game tied 3-3 in the top of the 7th, (4-man crew) we had a rundown between 3B & HP and the runner made a great dive back into the bag at 3B and the defender missed on the swipe tag.  Both defensive coaches came out of the dugout to argue with my U3...I made a beeline to the assistant to get him off my partner.  I had warned him in the 2nd for arguing balls/strikes from the 1B coaches box...and I had sent him to the dugout when he came out in the 5th to try and discuss a ball off the batter's foot.  So this incident was his 3rd time to interact with me (twice too many for an assistant coach but it was a playoff game and I really didn't want to eject a coach in that situation).  As I was walking him back to the dugout, he continued to argue.  I raised my voice to a commanding level and said "Get in the dugout."  He went to the edge and picked up a chair over his head and slammed it into the back wall of the dugout.  DONE!  Glad he made it easy on me...he looks really bad on paper...3 warnings prior to him losing his mind.

​At the college level, when a player gets dumped for tobacco, the HC always gets ejected. I would NOT consider that "Ejecting himself".

[woodiemiller]

Why would you allow an asst. Coach to interact with the umpires 2 other times before ejecting?  By rule, if they leave their coaches box to argue a call, they're gone.

​He typed it badly. I read it the same way you read it. But it was not the ASSistant coach he dumped. It was the HC.

[ElkOil]

Why would you allow an asst. Coach to interact with the umpires 2 other times before ejecting?  By rule, if they leave their coaches box to argue a call, they're gone.

​Can you cite that rule in FED?  I cant't find it.  

[scrounge]

​Can you cite that rule in FED?  I cant't find it.  

​3-3-1

ART. 1 . . . A coach, player, substitute, attendant or other bench personnel shall not:

f. commit any unsportsmanlike act to include, but not limited to,

6. any member of the coaching staff who is not the head coach (or designee) in 3-2-4 leaving the vicinity of the dugout or coaching box to dispute a judgment call by an umpire.

[ElkOil]

​3-3-1

ART. 1 . . . A coach, player, substitute, attendant or other bench personnel shall not:

f. commit any unsportsmanlike act to include, but not limited to,

6. any member of the coaching staff who is not the head coach (or designee) in 3-2-4 leaving the vicinity of the dugout or coaching box to dispute a judgment call by an umpire.

​Thank you!

[maven]

Why would you allow an asst. Coach to interact with the umpires 2 other times before ejecting?  By rule, if they leave their coaches box to argue a call, they're gone.

​I get trying to keep him in the game. But I also agree that 3 times is 2 times too many: my state wants the rule for ASSt coaches enforced, and I would simply give a warning before tossing him. "Coach, you need to return to the coaching box right now; I'll discuss the play with Jim [use HC's name here] if he wants, but you have to return to the box immediately." That's all he gets: if he persists, then he goes.

My only thought on the OP was: skip the shouting. Remember that everything is likely to end up on video: if you're shouting at the coach, you might appear to be the aggressor.

If you're calm and collected when you send the coach to the dugout, and he goes and tosses a chair, that makes a pretty compelling video. The big stage calls for being the bigger man.

[zoops]

​

​3-3-1

ART. 1 . . . A coach, player, substitute, attendant or other bench personnel shall not:

f. commit any unsportsmanlike act to include, but not limited to,

6. any member of the coaching staff who is not the head coach (or designee) in 3-2-4 leaving the vicinity of the dugout or coaching box to dispute a judgment call by an um

I wouldn't say it's automatic that they're gone.  

PENALTY:  For violation of f (6), both the head coach and the offending coach shall be restricted to the dugout for the remainder of the game, or if the offense is judged severe enough, the umpire may eject the offender and restrict or eject the head coach. Any coach restricted to the bench shall be ejected for further misconduct. A coach may leave the bench/dugout to attend to a player who becomes ill or injured. 

[zoops]

Why would you allow an asst. Coach to interact with the umpires 2 other times before ejecting?  By rule, if they leave their coaches box to argue a call, they're gone.

​I was trying to also quote this one in my post above...

[blue23ll]

It is not particularly relevant to the post, but is relevant in a general sense. When I umpired in California they didn't use a 'mixed' crew, we took our own crews and that worked very well. Here in Washington, we used 'mixed' crews and the 3 man I have worked here seemed to turn out okay. Unless you completely butcher a rotation nobody really knows but us if there are mistakes made. 

[BillKen]

In my state it is very frowned upon to eject coaches.  Texas may have a John Wayne reputation, we do not have a strong advocacy group at the state level for officials.  Our state governing body is run by a lot of ex coaches...so it isn't an official-friendly place.  For a coach to be ejected, he has to do something egregious like throw a chair.  If we dumped assistant coaches for arguing balls/strikes from the box or coming out to discuss a judgement call, we would be black-balled for state tournament slots...and scratched by coaches for district play.  Our coaches have the power to scratch any official that they don't like...even if the official is enforcing the rules properly.  It is jacked up...but being a redass isn't an option.  

So the whole point in posting was to show that we were patient and deliberate about getting a couple of close calls right and that if you give them enough rope, they will hang themselves.

I'm not sure what @Woodiemiller thinks I was trying to say because the situation didn't involve a 4-man issue...I didn't get rid of the head coach...and there was never a mention of tobacco.  

[blue23ll]

I will have to say, my personal experience has been that HS coaches are generally well behaved and courteous in my area. They seem to really work hard to not get ejected. Now and again we have a douchenozzzle acting crazy, but they usually don't last long. Schools won't put up with problems. I seem to have more problems with youth/select/travel ball daddy coaches, who think they are all Earl Weaver clones. The bright side is that I use kiddy ball to keep my game management skills honed. 

The Texas system of coach rating umpires never seemed to make much sense to me. 

@BillKen, I was wondering myself where @Woodiemiller was going with his responses, perhaps he was looking at a different thread and miss-posted? 

[Majordave]

Gentlemen,

Im sorry I jumped in hiding posts by a certain sour member yet again. You guys handled him well but I'm still trying to "train the lad" to stop posting irrelevant and sniping comments. He seems to be predisposed to try and start stuff under his guise of sparking thoughtful conversation. (It seems like a losing battle that is just wasting my time but I gotta try.......oh well.)

Mostly I just find it annoying as do some of you. Anyway I hid the irrelevant post and the responses. If you want it back PM me and I'll unhide what I've hidden. 

Play on!

[zoops]

In my state it is very frowned upon to eject coaches.  Texas may have a John Wayne reputation, we do not have a strong advocacy group at the state level for officials.  Our state governing body is run by a lot of ex coaches...so it isn't an official-friendly place.  For a coach to be ejected, he has to do something egregious like throw a chair.  If we dumped assistant coaches for arguing balls/strikes from the box or coming out to discuss a judgement call, we would be black-balled for state tournament slots...and scratched by coaches for district play.  Our coaches have the power to scratch any official that they don't like...even if the official is enforcing the rules properly.  It is jacked up...but being a redass isn't an option.  

​That would be rough to work under that system.  I've ejected one coach in 14 years of doing high school ball, but I think the major problem would be that the coaches are going to learn that they won't be disciplined for bad behavior and so their behavior is going to get progressively worse.  I see it all the time in basketball - the guys that let coaches walk all over them, well they get walked all over and the guys that don't take it generally have more respect from coaches, although some officials certainly overdo it.  I think you still have to stand your ground and enforce rules, even if it may mean losing some assignments.  If they know you're fair and work hard it should work out in time.  Easy for me to say though.