Pitcher's cap

[Sayhey]

varsity pitcher can't keep his cap on while pitching. After incident #12 I spoke to my plate umpire between innings about the poorly fitted cap and its frequent flier miles. He wanted no part of it. I left it alone. About the 20th time it happened I walked to the mound and told the pitcher he needed to find a way to keep his cap on. His coach wasn't happy and argued that there is no rule stating that the flying cap is illegal. I told the coach it was distracting to the batter and if it didn't stop his pitcher wouldn't becallowed to continue to pitch. I got zero support from my plate umpire.

If you can't have white sleeves or a white glove because it is distracting how can you be allowed to have your cap fly off your head every 4th pitch. Jaska/ Roder says the cap must be worn properly.

[Replacematt]

varsity pitcher can't keep his cap on while pitching. After incident #12 I spoke to my plate umpire between innings about the poorly fitted cap and its frequent flier miles. He wanted no part of it. I left it alone. About the 20th time it happened I walked to the mound and told the pitcher he needed to find a way to keep his cap on. His coach wasn't happy and argued that there is no rule stating that the flying cap is illegal. I told the coach it was distracting to the batter and if it didn't stop his pitcher wouldn't becallowed to continue to pitch. I got zero support from my plate umpire.

If you can't have white sleeves or a white glove because it is distracting how can you be allowed to have your cap fly off your head every 4th pitch. Jaska/ Roder says the cap must be worn properly.

Not your problem. If PU doesn't have an issue with it, don't step on his dick.

If you are PU, really tread carefully. Only address it if it is indeed distracting.

[Sayhey]

How can a cap coming off the pitcher's head not be distracting. My plate umpire after the game said it was distracting to him trying to call balls and strikes. 2015 Fed. Casebook-10.2.3. © f1's cap frequently falls off his head and in the umpire's judgement, it is either distracting to the batter or delaying the game. Ruling- the umpire shall instruct the defensive team's coach that F-1's cap must be secured. If this situation is not corrected, F-1 will be removed as pitcher. - the casebook says nothing about "treading lightly", or that the situation can only be addressed by the plate umpire. I was part of a crew that saw a violation. I talked to my plate umpire about it between innings. He refused to act because he was unsure of the rule. I reject your opinion that only the plate umpire can act I this situation. I also reject your childish language.

[NovaScotiaBlue]

We don't used FED ruleset in Canada BUT...you found a, pardon the pun, a rule to hang your hat on, So going back to your OP, nothing was done and you are looking for validation that you were right that it should have?? I think you have proven to yourself that it should have been addressed and I agree that this is not soely the purview of the PU. Can I assume that if the game were played today you would enforce rule 10.2.3.? 

[Jocko]

Use the rules to solve problems. If this was a problem, there's a rule to solve it. If it wasn't a problem, no need in picking nits. I wasn't there, so I have no idea how much of an issue it caused. Sounds more like it was annoying than distracting.

[noumpere]

In most places, issues with the pitcher are PUs concern.

 

You were right to raise the issue with PU.  If you knew the rule at the time, then you should have explained it to PU, and maybe even used the "I'll take the hit on this" line.

 

But, if PU doesn't want to enforce it (or if you didn't know the rule at the time), then stay away.

[MidAmUmp]

You've posted this under Ask The Ump yet you ask no questions. When another umpire offers you some pretty sound advice you inform him that he's using "childish language" and throw out a rule reference to justify what you did. So I'm assuming you're simply relaying a story from your game and just put it in the wrong section. Otherwise, why they hell are you posting this? Obviously you're not seeking feedback on how the situation might have been handled better.

 

I'm curious, how do you know it was distracting to the batters? Were you wandering back there in between pitches to inquire?

 

This doesn't concern you unless a batter calls time and yells out to you, "Excuse me sir. Yes, you. That pitcher's hat falling off is very distracting to me. Can you please do something about it?"

 

If I'm working the plate and you come in and do this to me...we're going to have major problems.

 

I think you're confusing the word distracting for the word annoying.

 

Umpire by the rules or with the rules. Just because you have a gun and bullets doesn't mean you have to use them. The only thing I would have considered doing is if players or coaches were coming to me complaining that it was distracting and it was obvious I was with an inexperienced umpire who didn't know how to handle it, I would have gone to the coach and asked him if there was anything he could do to resolve the situation? If they can find a better fitting hat, great. If he got belligerent about it, then I can pull out the rule bullet and make him aware of what could potentially happen if the situation doesn't get fixed.

 

Ignore, address, enforce. Common sense & fair play. Do you pick up the sh!tty end of the stick or the clean end? I usually go for the clean end, but if I have to pick up the other end, I put on gloves first.

[Rich Ives]

Jim Bouton

[Sayhey]

When I got home from the game I opened up my Jaska/Roder and the Fed. Rule book. I found that Jaska/Roder referred me to 10.2.3© that didn't make sense because that section of the rule book is about umpire duties. I looked under cap and uniform for rules interpretation. I called another umpire and he had just studied this subject. Upon closer review 10.2.3© is the correct reference. It's hidden in plain sight in casebook.

I was looking for help. I thought the question was obvious. Next time, if there is a next time, I will state that I'm asking a question. I completely disagree that only the plate umpire can handle this. The plate umpire refused to deal with it. Please tell me how a cap coming off the head of a pitcher can be anything but distracting? As far as dicks and other body parts, half of you on here need to grow up and get a way better attitude

[Sayhey]

Mid Am ump. Big ego. SH*#ty attitude. We umpire as a crew

[Jocko]

When I got home from the game I opened up my Jaska/Roder and the Fed. Rule book. I found that Jaska/Roder referred me to 10.2.3© that didn't make sense because that section of the rule book is about umpire duties. I looked under cap and uniform for rules interpretation. I called another umpire and he had just studied this subject. Upon closer review 10.2.3© is the correct reference. It's hidden in plain sight in casebook.

I was looking for help. I thought the question was obvious. Next time, if there is a next time, I will state that I'm asking a question. I completely disagree that only the plate umpire can handle this. The plate umpire refused to deal with it. Please tell me how a cap coming off the head of a pitcher can be anything but distracting? As far as dicks and other body parts, half of you on here need to grow up and get a way better attitude

I must have missed something. Oh well. Again, I say that this sounds more annoying than distracting. Like young R2s clapping. Doesn't bother anyone but me. I've seen MLB F1s put so much of their back into the pitch that their cap falls off. Granted, not numerous times, but it happens. As far as which umpire calls it, we both have jurisdiction. However, as Jason pointed out, most of these types of thing involving F1 will PRIMARILY fall under HP's responsibility. Simply because, in my opinion, he has the same vantage point as the batters. I think the right thing is to discuss it with your partner and get on the same page. If HP doesn't have a problem then it's doubtful that the batters are either. And it would look OOO for BU to interject himself. Just my $.02

[noumpere]

When I got home from the game I opened up my Jaska/Roder and the Fed. Rule book. I found that Jaska/Roder referred me to 10.2.3© that didn't make sense because that section of the rule book is about umpire duties. I looked under cap and uniform for rules interpretation. I called another umpire and he had just studied this subject. Upon closer review 10.2.3© is the correct reference. It's hidden in plain sight in casebook.

I was looking for help. I thought the question was obvious. Next time, if there is a next time, I will state that I'm asking a question. I completely disagree that only the plate umpire can handle this. The plate umpire refused to deal with it. Please tell me how a cap coming off the head of a pitcher can be anything but distracting? As far as dicks and other body parts, half of you on here need to grow up and get a way better attitude

So, let me summarize:

 

You weren't sure of the rule.  Your partner wasn't sure of the rule.  But, you wanted him to enforce something that neither of you were sure about, and (apparently) the other team wasn't complaining about?

 

So, you were right to go in and ask.  You were right to go home and check.  I hope you emailed your partner so now you are both sure.

 

But, you were wrong to then address it with the pitcher (at least in most areas), and you're wrong to blame your partner for not knowing / enforcing a rule that you also didn't know.

 

And, to be honest, I don't really see any "attitude" issues from other posters in this thread.  Just because someone disagrees with what you did, doesn't mean he has an attitude problem.

[Jocko]

Personally, I tend to give weight to what @MidAmUmp has to say. He has the credentials, experience, and knowledge to back up what he says. @Sayhey , I don't disagree with you that it COULD be distracting. But consider the age of your players. If they're non-shavers, chances are they are just doing the best they can. And this is an arcane rule, to say the least. As quoted in Referee magazine, don't try to impress ppl with your rules knowledge. Just call the game (I'm paraphrasing). If the batters or coaches bring it up, by all means address it. If noone but you sees it as a problem..... I will stipulate that your HP said it was distracting him to some degree AFTER the game. If it wasn't enough for him to address at the time, especially after your crew conference, I'd say just let it be. Let it beeeeeee. Let it be, yeah let it be. Whisper words of wisdom, my brother. Let it be.

[Sayhey]

My plate umpire and I went to dinner after the game. He had zero problem with me talking to him about the rule between innings. He had zero problem with me talking to the coach about it when incident #25 happened. He didn't act because he was unsure of the rule and apparently I wasn't convincing anyone with my rules knowledge. I think it's poor sportsmanship.how can it not be distracting and how can it not be an advantage? At dinner, my plate umpire said it was distracting to him calling balls and strikes.very cool Beatles reference. Great song. The coach wanted to know why I waited until the 5th inning. I told him I was being lenient and I was hoping it would stop. 25 times isn't a few times. My job is to manage the game and make sure the playing field is level. I believe the cap coming off is an advantage. It is a rule in the 2015 casebook. Should we enforce the rule with wisdom and paitience or should we "let it be" completely.

[ricka56]

The battery is in PU's domain. Yes, BU calls balks, but how F1/F2 conduct business is PU's. It isn't written anywhere...it's just how it is.

[Sayhey]

Reading carefully is important. No where in my post did I say that I didn't know the rule. I've known the rule for 20 years. I told my partner the rule. My partner talked to the coach between innings. The coach did nothing to fix the problem and after incident 20 I addressed the situation. The coach told me there is no rule to back me up. I don't see it as a trivial and arcane rule.how do I know it's distracing? Because I have common sense. As a plate umpire we watch the arm slot area to see the release of the ball. If a cap is flying off the pitcher's head how is that not distracting? You can tell that is a question by the question mark. How's the attitudes on Umpire Empire? Answer- a little too much

[Richvee]

So did they fix the cap from coming off or did you throw F1 out?

[ElkOil]

To answer the best I can, when you ask how a cap flying off is anything but distracting, I'll give you the benefit of your in-person experience and agree that it is.  So then the next question is, how do you handle it to the game's best advantage?  Personally, I don't try to umpire my way through a coaching situation, and this seems like it could (should?) have been handled as a coaching situation.  So instead of mucking up the waters with rules and who is responsible for what and creating friction, sometimes these situations are best handled quietly between innings by approaching the coach and asking him to address it.  Sometimes it works well to say something like, "Hey, coach.  Would you mind helping your pitcher out with his cap? It's not an issue right now, but I wouldn't want anyone to find it distracting, or have it become a larger issue," or something along those lines.  And this isn't to be said with a foreboding tone as if you'll exact a punitive measure for lack of compliance, rather, you're just trying a little preventive umpiring so a mountain isn't made out of a mole hill.  And then if someone says something later, he can't say it wasn't brought to his attention.  And if you get distracted by it, well, sometimes that's just one of the challenges of our job.  Parents and fans sometimes try their level best to distract you, but you find a way to persevere.  

[Jocko]

Reading carefully is important. No where in my post did I say that I didn't know the rule. I've known the rule for 20 years. I told my partner the rule. My partner talked to the coach between innings. The coach did nothing to fix the problem and after incident 20 I addressed the situation. The coach told me there is no rule to back me up. I don't see it as a trivial and arcane rule.how do I know it's distracing? Because I have common sense. As a plate umpire we watch the arm slot area to see the release of the ball. If a cap is flying off the pitcher's head how is that not distracting? You can tell that is a question by the question mark. How's the attitudes on Umpire Empire? Answer- a little too much

you were there. I wasn't. All I can give is my opinion. If I have this same issue, I will address it at that time. Sounds like your game ended without much incident. So, no harm no foul, yes? I'm trying hard not to be condescending or condemning. Hope that's how I've come across thus far.

[Thunderheads]

Reading carefully is important. No where in my post did I say that I didn't know the rule. I've known the rule for 20 years. I told my partner the rule. My partner talked to the coach between innings. The coach did nothing to fix the problem and after incident 20 I addressed the situation. The coach told me there is no rule to back me up. I don't see it as a trivial and arcane rule.how do I know it's distracing? Because I have common sense. As a plate umpire we watch the arm slot area to see the release of the ball. If a cap is flying off the pitcher's head how is that not distracting? You can tell that is a question by the question mark. How's the attitudes on Umpire Empire? Answer- a little too much

but you never cited it in your OP

 

you never said this in the OP

 

your OP doesn't have a question mark in it

 

In closing @Sayhey; YOUR past behavior on this site is why you don't like some of the responses, reap / sow.  You're far too sensitive to anyone's response, as you've been in the past.

Suggestion:  Decaf.

 

The attitudes here are just fine based on everything presented. 

[Guest roothog66]

Let me ask this, based on the thread because it does occasionally come up. Sunglasses? If a pitcher is wearing sunglasses and no one has complained about it being a distraction (and by no one, I mean an actual batter) is it up to the umpire to declare it a distraction? Under the rules, does it even matter if the umpire finds it distracting if the batters do not?

[BuckeyeMike]

If I'm the PU and F1's sunglasses are distracting ME from performing my duties, then you can bet F1 is 1) going without sunglasses or 2) getting a different pair from someone until he finds a pair that are no longer distracting.   

 

If F1's sunglasses aren't distracting ME from my duties and I've heard no complaints, he can keep them. 

 

Just my .02 

YMMV

[Sayhey]

The plate umpire did ask the coach in between innings to fix the problem. He refused. I told the head coach it must be corrected or his pitcher would have to play another position. My partner told the head coach we would play on and take no action and we would talk about it after the game. At dinner he said he would bring it up at our next meeting. You don't have to be present to know rhat a cap coming off the pitcher's head is distracting to a batter. Common sense and an imagination can help you visualize, or you can read rule 10.2.3© or you can tear that page out of the 2015 casebook. How any umpire can think this is ok is bewildering.

[Sayhey]

I'm not hyper sensitive. I just wanted some help on a rule. Half the umpires on this site come off as super umps with big egos and smart ass comments. I didn't step on anyone's dick, which is the comment of a child masquerading as a man. I'm not the only one that thinks there are miserable s.o.b.s on this site. My partner was fine with everything I said and did. I talked and acted very gently and slowly on this until the head coach became a 200 lb. Rat. Even then we never required the pitcher or coach to do anything. No one spoke a single word in anger and everyone was friendly after the game.

[Senor Azul]

Mr. Ives, what do you remember of Jim Bouton's problem with his cap coming off during his pitching motion? I am a contemporary of yours and do not remember any big issues made of his pitching delivery. Perhaps only in New York? An article in Wikipedia described him this way:

 

...he came to be known for his cap flying off his head at the completion of his delivery to the plate...

[Replacematt]

I'm not hyper sensitive. I just wanted some help on a rule. Half the umpires on this site come off as super umps with big egos and smart ass comments. I didn't step on anyone's dick, which is the comment of a child masquerading as a man.

I can assure you that it is not. What is the hallmark of a child is changing one's story and adds to it to make it more palatable after being called out on it.

 

I'm not the only one that thinks there are miserable s.o.b.s on this site.

Then leave.