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What was Joe thinking?????

Jocko

By Jocko
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acpar72
acpar72

My first thought was that Joe would be having a "chat" with the crew after the game regarding no backup.

SJA
SJA

HA! . . . didn't look like Joe needed any backup to me! . . . but I know what you mean. :-)

JaxRolo
JaxRolo

Not even close to excessive. We can not let players behave like this. Make an example of the MLB players and just maybe (not likely) it will have a trickle effect on our players and coaches that this

MadMax

MadMax

Posted
Posted

What the hell heck is Billy Ripken talking about??!!

 

 

As umpires, we are the Guardians of The Game. I don't have to write a whole novel about the honor and sanctity of Baseball... what that Preppybrat (Papelbon, I know who) did is lewd, crude, and has no business being on display in baseball. Rule 9.01d is in the OBR book for a reason. West didn't "insert himself into the situation" just because he wanted to "make it about himself". West conducted it succinctly and directly, and as discreetly as possible. "Hey. John. Get out." (Or "You're done." or "You're gone.")

 

West was well within his rights to move Papelbon out of the way. Papelbon has already been ejected, and not only has Papelbon chased down West to confront him, but no-one else is coming in to intervene (especially off the Phillies). Pap's on his own on this one, and no apologies, Mr. West has a game to get back to... which Jonathan obviously doesn't want to be a part of any more.

 

Most of today's culture has lost respect for authority, and for consequences.

 

It would seem that Billy Ripken still thinks himself a young man, impervious to consequences. Or, he still is fostering the "Us (players and coaches) versus Them (Umpires)" stigma that continues to hide in dark corners of baseball.

 

Bravo Harold Reynolds. Bravo. I will be severely disappointed in MLB if West is punished in any way... and that's my sentiment as a fan and human being, not an umpire.

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UmpireFever

UmpireFever

Posted
Posted

What the hell heck is Billy Ripken talking about??!!

 

 

As umpires, we are the Guardians of The Game. I don't have to write a whole novel about the honor and sanctity of Baseball... what that Preppybrat (Papelbon, I know who) did is lewd, crude, and has no business being on display in baseball. Rule 9.01d is in the OBR book for a reason. West didn't "insert himself into the situation" just because he wanted to "make it about himself". West conducted it succinctly and directly, and as discreetly as possible. "Hey. John. Get out." (Or "You're done." or "You're gone.")

 

West was well within his rights to move Papelbon out of the way. Papelbon has already been ejected, and not only has Papelbon chased down West to confront him, but no-one else is coming in to intervene (especially off the Phillies). Pap's on his own on this one, and no apologies, Mr. West has a game to get back to... which Jonathan obviously doesn't want to be a part of any more.

 

Most of today's culture has lost respect for authority, and for consequences.

 

It would seem that Billy Ripken still thinks himself a young man, impervious to consequences. Or, he still is fostering the "Us (players and coaches) versus Them (Umpires)" stigma that continues to hide in dark corners of baseball.

 

Bravo Harold Reynolds. Bravo. I will be severely disappointed in MLB if West is punished in any way... and that's my sentiment as a fan and human being, not an umpire.

IMO to say he shouldn't be punished in any way is a stretch. It's still unacceptable to touch a player. Did Papelbon give Joe a choice? Not really. A fine. A slap on the wrist for Joe, but nothing too extreme. 

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Rich Ives

Rich Ives

Posted
Posted

Papelbon at least admitted that there might be a Luciano/Weaver relationship in effect - at least from Paps perspective.

 

OTOH, Papelbon is the guy that got all bent out of shape because at the All-Star Game at Yankee Stadium some idiot manager let Mariano Rivera close the game instead of him.

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law_reb

law_reb

Posted
Posted

I'm certainly in favor of a hands off approach.  However, in this instance Joe has told Pap to leave the dugout and then he turns to return to his position.  Pap comes out of the dugout and gets in front of him, in very close proximity.  I don't have any problem with what Joe did.  Pap is yelling at him and bumping into him.  Joe was done dealing with him.  Surely no one expects he would stand there and let this guy continue.  He moved him to the side and continued to his position.  Leaving Pap there to hold his junk.   

 

Obviously, we didn't see everything that happened watching the videos in this thread.  From what I saw, I'm not sure I would have gotten involved to begin with.  Was it a crotch grab to the fans?  Maybe, probably?  I don't think it was blatant enough to be 100% sure.  I think I let MLB sort that out in NYC and I call the game on the field.   

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lawump

lawump

Posted
Posted

Here are my (not asked for) 2 cents...

 

1.  Ripken is a RAT for suggesting that West just ejected Papelbon because he was mad Papelbon blew the save and caused West to worry that he would miss his flight on get-away day.

 

2.  I agree with Reynolds' analysis on how West handled the post-ejection confrontation.  I would never put my hands on a player as West did (I would step back and point at the player's head and say loudly, "that's a bump!"), but I can understand that when you have a guy who has made contact with the bill of your cap twice and who is physically blocking your path (with his arms extended) that one could act the way West did.  In the real world, what Papelbon did was a common-law assault (threat of harm) and battery (unlawful touching of another).  In the real world, West would be allowed to respond in equal kind to the battery...which is what he did: he just moved the aggressor (Papelbon) so he could walk away.  However, the baseball field (especially a pro baseball field) is often not the real world (if it was the real world, players would be arrested when there is a brawl.  Jose Offerman not withstanding, players are never arrested when this happens.)  Hence, since this is not the real world, I would not, personally, put my hands on a player.  I would just notify them of the bump (when he made contact with my cap), and fill out my report accordingly. 

 

3.  With that all said:  I can't believe that Papelbon was ejected for that on a professional field.  I get ejecting a player who did that on a little league field.  I get ejecting a player who did that on a high school field.  I get ejecting a player who did that on an American Legion field.  I (probably) get ejecting a player who did that on a college field.  But, I cannot believe that he was ejected for this on a pro/MLB field. 

 

While Ripken's analysis as to why West ejected Papelbon was nothing but pure RAT-ese (see #1 above), his analysis that West should not have ejected Papelbon (and that West should have let the Phillies or the League handle it) is spot-on.  I am willing to bet a whole lot of money that other than Angel Hernandez, there is not another umpire in MLB who would have ejected Papelbon in this situation.  On the pro level, we were trained that if they aren't yelling at us (or making obscene gestures at us) to ignore it (unless the players from opposite teams are screaming at each other and threatening to fight.) 

 

Seriously, if a player did this on a field when I was a pro umpire (or even if they did it on a college field I was working), I am going to laugh at the player (notice I said "at" and not "with") because I know that the player is going to get fined and or suspended.  BUT, there is no need for me to eject the player and insert myself into the situation.  He isn't bothering or attacking me.  Frankly, the league WILL handle it.  And if the league wants my "testimony" as to what I saw, they can call me.

 

[i understand that all bets are off in amateur baseball; especially as the players get younger.]

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Richvee

Richvee

Posted
Posted

I watch a lot of MLB tonight. That's not the first time Ripken has taken the anti- umpire side of an issue. He never has a good word for them. Likewise, watching some of the Cal Ripken World Series this summer, Cal wasn't "warm and fuzzy" when talking about calls and umpires during those games. I don't thoink there's a lot of respect for our brotherhood in the Ripken household. Probably passed down from Cal Sr.  

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lawump

lawump

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Posted

Well, one MLB umpire (I believe Rocky Roe) got them all back when he yelled at Senior (who was managing the Orioles), "the only reason you're here (managing the Orioles) is 'cause you had two good nights with the old lady."  Or, words to those effect.  Yes, Cal, Sr., went nuts and yes he was tossed.  This story was in one umpire's autobiography.

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Rich Ives

Rich Ives

Posted
Posted

Well, one MLB umpire (I believe Rocky Roe) got them all back when he yelled at Senior (who was managing the Orioles), "the only reason you're here (managing the Orioles) is 'cause you had two good nights with the old lady."  Or, words to those effect.  Yes, Cal, Sr., went nuts and yes he was tossed.  This story was in one umpire's autobiography.

 

That was really a class act now wasn't it?  Bet the comment wasn't mentioned in the ejection report.

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zm1283

zm1283

Posted
Posted

 

Well, one MLB umpire (I believe Rocky Roe) got them all back when he yelled at Senior (who was managing the Orioles), "the only reason you're here (managing the Orioles) is 'cause you had two good nights with the old lady."  Or, words to those effect.  Yes, Cal, Sr., went nuts and yes he was tossed.  This story was in one umpire's autobiography.

 

That was really a class act now wasn't it?  Bet the comment wasn't mentioned in the ejection report.

 

 

Where did he say it was classy?

 

There were lots of things back in the day that were said between umpires/players/managers that were not suitable for print.

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blue23ll

blue23ll

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Posted

 

Does anyone else recall seeing a player ejected for making gestures to the fans?

I don't know. Haven't been able to watch all the games in the history of baseball!

 

You better get busy then, bucko!!

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