B/C on infield grounders

[umpire_scott]

What advice can anyone give on the best practices for positioning on infield grounders while in the middle. Take the following situations and tell me where you generally go and where do you try to end up when making these calls.

A. In "C" position with 2 outs, grounder to SS who is most likely going to throw to 1st for the final out.

B. Runners on 1st and 2nd, so I'm in "C", 1 out ground ball to 3rd baseman.

[MUAump2]

A. Open up as the ball passes you, watch the fielder field the ball, once you realize he's got it cleanly, take as many steps as you can toward first (without getting in the line of fire), get set and watch the play at first. Ideally, you want to get to the first base side of the mound, moving toward the 45ft line to get the angle at first.

B. Kind of the same concept, watch where the ball takes the fielder...his right, he's most likely going to step on third, then throw to first. Hit to his left, throw to 2nd then first, so move in kind of the same manner as above. Watch where the ball takes the fielder, then adjust. Don't assume anything.

[Jocko]

Exactly right. Higher levels are easier because you can anticipate. They do what they're supposed to. Lower levels you never know

[Replacematt]

The positions in the book are starting positions. From there, you go where you need to. Positioning as a play develops is fluid--the ending point is not definitive.

[noumpere]

You almost always move toward the working area but sometimes you get right up behind the mound but on balls to F5 or to F6 moving in that can put you in the way so move more toward the corner of the working area thats closer to the B position.

Moving up behind the mound is preferred and not just because it puts you in a good position to clean off the rubber. ;)

[johnnyg08]

You have to open to the ball though b/c as somebody else posted...kids will do odd things.

[mstaylor]

You have to open to the ball, but as the is coming through the infield you read is to F5,F6 or F4. If it is to F6 then I move toward the mound and toward first. That gives me an angle and clears the throwing lane. If it is to F5 then I don't go as far toward the mound and just concentrate on moving to first.If it goes to F4, I just move toward first.

[umpire_scott]

You almost always move toward the working area but sometimes you get right up behind the mound but on balls to F5 or to F6 moving in that can put you in the way so move more toward the corner of the working area thats closer to the B position.

Moving up behind the mound is preferred and not just because it puts you in a good position to clean off the rubber.

Now that was funny.

[Donny]

I've been having trouble getting out of the way on grounders to F6 when starting at the C position also, so this advice is helpful.  I've been moving laterally but I have to get in the habit of also moving towards the mound on these.

How about a grounder up the middle (to F6's left) and R1/R2 and less than 2 out?  Staying in position could block the fielder's view of grounder.  Moving towards the B position would almost certainly get in throwing lane if he goes to 1b.  Moving to the mound takes me further away from a play at 2b.

Thanks in advance!

[Richvee]

38 minutes ago, Donny said:

I've been having trouble getting out of the way on grounders to F6 when starting at the C position also, so this advice is helpful.  I've been moving laterally but I have to get in the habit of also moving towards the mound on these.

How about a grounder up the middle (to F6's left) and R1/R2 and less than 2 out?  Staying in position could block the fielder's view of grounder.  Moving towards the B position would almost certainly get in throwing lane if he goes to 1b.  Moving to the mound takes me further away from a play at 2b.

Thanks in advance!

Your first step should be forward and turn as the ball passes you. Now you're facing F6. Set hands on knees to make the call on the play at 2B, see that, then make the cal as you drop step and take a step or two towards 1B line for back half of the double play. get set again to make the call at first. Now bounce back and be ready for a return throw to F5 that may happen as R2 rounds 3B. 

[maven]

Thank goodness we revived this 4 year old thread for a basic mechanics question.

[Donny]

2 hours ago, Richvee said:

Your first step should be forward and turn as the ball passes you. Now you're facing F6. Set hands on knees to make the call on the play at 2B, see that, then make the cal as you drop step and take a step or two towards 1B line for back half of the double play. get set again to make the call at first. Now bounce back and be ready for a return throw to F5 that may happen as R2 rounds 3B. 

Richvee, thanks for the reply.  By the "first step should be forward," you mean towards the mound?

The way you described is pretty much how I've been doing it, but where it gets tricky is if F6 decides not to go to 2b, maybe after a bobble or if R1 was moving on the pitch.  It always seems that I'm in his throwing lane to 1b.  I've even had to duck under a throw before turning to 1b.  Should I be moving even closer to the mound?

 

[Donny]

2 hours ago, maven said:

Thank goodness we revived this 4 year old thread for a basic mechanics question.

I assume you're being sarcastic here?

[Richvee]

31 minutes ago, Donny said:

Richvee, thanks for the reply.  By the "first step should be forward," you mean towards the mound?

The way you described is pretty much how I've been doing it, but where it gets tricky is if F6 decides not to go to 2b, maybe after a bobble or if R1 was moving on the pitch.  It always seems that I'm in his throwing lane to 1b.  I've even had to duck under a throw before turning to 1b.  Should I be moving even closer to the mound?

 

You may be starting to far back? You should be on a line drawn from HP through the edge of the pitcher's mound, half way between the plate and 2B. A step forward and a turn from there should have you well out of the line of fire from a throw to 1B from F6

[Richvee]

31 minutes ago, Donny said:

Richvee, thanks for the reply.  By the "first step should be forward," you mean towards the mound?

The way you described is pretty much how I've been doing it, but where it gets tricky is if F6 decides not to go to 2b, maybe after a bobble or if R1 was moving on the pitch.  It always seems that I'm in his throwing lane to 1b.  I've even had to duck under a throw before turning to 1b.  Should I be moving even closer to the mound?

 

You may be starting to far back? You should be on a line drawn from HP through the edge of the pitcher's mound, half way between the plate and 2B. A step forward and a turn from there should have you well out of the line of fire from a throw to 1B from F6

[udbrky]

Where I have issues in being in the line of fire, is when F6 is taken a ways away and you're not sure where the throw is going - 1b or 2b. And SS is moving, and I'm trying to get out of his lane, yet not get out of position for possible throw to 2b, but lose a feel for where I'm at.

[maineump]

I agree with the starting too far back. It seems like you are close in the C slot, but you need to be as close as you are in the B slot.

I use first step up, open to the ball, read the play, and then quick cross over steps to make the call at 1B.

If it is a double play ball the first step is towards the working area, then the cross over isn't towards 1B, but towards the 1B line (like the 45' line area).

It is all about reading the play and SMOOTH cross over steps, to keep your eyes level to be able to follow the ball

If you come to a complete stop to read the play at 2B (in older levels), then you will be out of position for the close one at 1B. Steady smooth cross-over works really well for me.

Always be ready for the play back to 3B, and get a good angle. Angle over distance for all of these calls.

[udbrky]

This is something I definitely want to work on for next year.

[noumpere]

19 hours ago, Donny said:

Moving to the mound takes me further away from a play at 2b.

Why do you need to be close to second for the front end of a double play attempt?  And, if the play develops in such a way that you feel the need to move a couple of steps colser, you'll have plenty of time to do so.

[maineump]

53 minutes ago, noumpere said:

Why do you need to be close to second for the front end of a double play attempt?  And, if the play develops in such a way that you feel the need to move a couple of steps colser, you'll have plenty of time to do so.

Exactly - the closer you are to 2B takes away the angles to see the possible area play at 2B, and it definitely takes you out of the play at 1B. The close play in the double play will be at 1B.

I have seen some guys get into the working area, and 'roll' around the mound to see the play at 1B, and it works really well for them. In a two-man system, you need to pre-plan where you are going before you have to do it. As a player we were taught, what do I do if I get the ball - where do I throw it? We need to use the same mentality as umpires - don't let the play blow up on you.

[BT_Blue]

@Richveedid a good job of explaining the mechanics of taking a double play. HOWEVER, please DO NOT go hands on knees for the front end call on a double play (aka the play at second). Doing that, it will you to long to come out of thar stance to see the play at first (which usually will be closer than the one at second.)

Take the play at second in a standing or athletic set. Not hands on knees.

[Richvee]

52 minutes ago, BT_Blue said:

@Richveedid a good job of explaining the mechanics of taking a double play. HOWEVER, please DO NOT go hands on knees for the front end call on a double play (aka the play at second). Doing that, it will you to long to come out of thar stance to see the play at first (which usually will be closer than the one at second.)

Take the play at second in a standing or athletic set. Not hands on knees.

Good point

[BT_Blue]

9 minutes ago, Richvee said:

Good point

Normally HOK is not a bad idea. But on plays, like a DP, where there are multiple bases, runners, or other components. HOK is generally a bad way to go.

[catsbackr]

Chest to ball and move into position with the fielders.