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Senor Azul

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Senor Azul last won the day on August 14 2017

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About Senor Azul

  • Birthday 07/16/1947

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  1. From the 2017 Jaksa/Roder manual (p. 146): A slip (as opposed to a pitch or throw) is a released baseball, intended to be a pitch or throw, but that lacks both aim and momentum. Any intended pitch that slips out of a pitcher’s hand and crosses (or, if it is touched, would have crossed) a foul line is a ball. An intended pitch that slips and does not cross a foul line is a balk if there is a runner, and no pitch if there is not a runner. (6.02b Comment) An intended pickoff throw (in-contact) to first or third base that slips is a balk if it does not reach the foul line or a fielder within reach of a tag attempt at the base. However, it is not a balk if a pitcher drops the ball or allows it to slip after a step to second base, which does not require a throw. It is a balk if a pitcher who is in-contact steps to first or third base…but does not complete the throw to that base. This includes an attempted in-contact throw that slips out of the pitcher’s hand and does not reach the foul line or a fielder within reach of a tag attempt at first or third base. 2015 FED rule 6-1-4: ART. 4 . . . Each legal pitch shall be declared by the umpire as a strike, ball, fair or foul hit or a dead ball. A pitch dropped during delivery and which crosses a foul line shall be called a ball. Otherwise, it will be called no pitch. A pitch dropped during delivery with at least one runner on base would be a balk if it does not cross a foul line. FED rule 6-2-4 . . . Balk. If there is a runner or runners, any of the following acts by a pitcher while he is touching the pitcher’s plate is a balk: a. any feinting toward the batter or first base, or any dropping of the ball (even though accidental) and the ball does not cross a foul line;
  2. Well, you got me, Mr. Jimurray. I can’t find any discussion of a slip vs. throw in the BRD or any case play in FED dealing with a slip during a pickoff attempt (see case play below dealing with a slipped pitch attempt). But I have the following--from the 2013 Wendelstedt manual (p. 106): It is a balk when… The pitcher, while touching his plate, accidentally or intentionally drops the ball, or the ball slips from his hand during the delivery; and the ball does not cross the foul line. …If, in dropping the ball, it crosses either foul line, it should be considered a pitch, and it is not a balk. If a catcher or other fielder were to field the ball before it could cross a foul line, it should be called a balk. This does not include if it were still possible for the batter to hit the pitch, however, other penalties under defensive interference may apply. It is a balk when…In throwing to first or third base, the pitcher drops the ball (or it slips from his hand) and the ball does not reach an area where the umpire adjudges that a play is being made on the runner (he didn’t throw to the base). 2015 FED 6.1.2 Situation A: With no runners on base, F1 starts his windup or preliminary motion and the ball slips from his hand. There is no infraction provided F1 delivers a pitch within 20 seconds after he received the ball. If F1 fails to do so, the batter is awarded a ball. If there had been a runner or runners on base, dropping the ball while in contact with the pitcher’s plate is a balk if the ball did not cross the foul line. Each base runner shall be awarded one base.
  3. From the 2016 Baseball Rule Differences by Carl Childress (section 372, p. 249): FED only. As B1 is streaking between first and second following a hit to the outfield, F4 pounds his glove as if about to receive a throw. BR slows down and stops on second. Ruling: F4’s action is not a fake tag but a legal decoy. FED Official Interpretation: Hopkins: Any verbal decoy, such as “I’ve got it,” is obstruction. (Website 2001 #14) Official Interpretation: Rumble: As the catcher throws a pop fly to F4 with a runner stealing, if a team member bangs bats together to simulate the sound of the batted ball, the umpire calls obstruction and ejects the offender. (Website 1999 #6) Note: The interpretation—by inference—legitimizes the catcher’s pop fly. “Because of the clanging of bats, obstruction will be called” is the language of the ruling. But the second baseman must not augment his acting with verbal communication. Note: Almost all physical decoys, “dekes” as they are called, are legal: pretending to field a grounder, catch a popup, glove a throw, or throwing a “popup” into the air on a steal. The one physical decoy that’s forbidden is the fake tag.
  4. Senor Azul

    Picking off a runner

    From the 2016 BRD (section 421, p. 281): FED: The pitcher may not attempt to pickoff from the windup position. (6-1-2) PENALTY: balk. NCAA: From the windup position the pitcher may attempt a pickoff (9-1a-1b) if he steps directly with his non-pivot foot toward the base before throwing (9-1a-6), gains ground with the step (9-1c), and has not begun any “natural pitching motion” before the step. (9-1a-3) OBR: Same as NCAA. (5.07a-1 Comment B)
  5. Senor Azul

    When is a Sac fly a Sac fly?

    From the 2018 OBR rule 5.08 Comment… APPROVED RULING: One out, Jones on third, Smith on first, and Brown flies out to right field. Two outs. Jones tags up and scores after the catch. Smith attempted to return to first but the right fielder’s throw beat him to the base. Three outs. But Jones scored before the throw to catch Smith reached first base, hence Jones’ run counts. It was not a force play. By the way, it was a double play by definition and should be recorded as such by the scorekeeper— A DOUBLE PLAY is a play by the defense in which two offensive players are put out as a result of continuous action, providing there is no error between putouts.
  6. Senor Azul

    Trapped ball at first

    The FED definition of catch in rule 2-9-1 actually mentions the ball touching the ground-- 2017 NFHS rule 2-9-1 NOTE: When a batted ball or a pitch is involved, the above definition of a catch applies. For any other thrown ball, the term is used loosely to also apply to a pick-up or to the trapping of a low throw which has touched the ground. A fielder may have the ball in his grasp even though it is touching the ground while in his glove.
  7. Senor Azul

    Dropped third strike and errors

    Here’s the other example (same type of play but scored differently) that Mr. roughie mentioned-- Detroit Tigers @ Texas Rangers 6/25/14 (play-by-play from retrosheet.org)-- RANGERS 8TH: KELLY STAYED IN GAME (PLAYING 3B); CHAMBERLAIN REPLACED COKE (PITCHING); Choice grounded out (shortstop to first); Chirinos flied to center; Odor struck out but advanced to third on a wild pitch; Martin lined to right; 0 R, 0 H, 1 E, 1 LOB. Tigers 8, Rangers 5. According to the box score found at retrosheet.org, the Tigers pitcher Joba Chamberlain was charged with a wild pitch in the 8th inning and the Tigers catcher Bryan Holaday was charged with an error on the same play that allowed Rangers batter Rougned Odor to reach third base on the strikeout.
  8. Senor Azul

    steal attempt on ball four

    OBR rule 5.09(b) Retiring a Runner Any runner is out when...: (4) He is tagged, when the ball is alive, while off his base. EXCEPTION: A batter-runner cannot be tagged out after overrunning or oversliding first base if he returns immediately to the base; Rule 5.09(b)(6) Comment: PLAY—Runner on first and three balls on batter: Runner steals on the next pitch, which is fourth ball, but after having touched second he overslides or overruns that base. Catcher’s throw catches him before he can return. Ruling is that runner is out. (Force out is removed.) OVERSLIDE (or OVERSLIDING) is the act of an offensive player when his slide to a base, other than when advancing from home to first base, is with such momentum that he loses contact with the base.
  9. Senor Azul

    Force out

    Here’s the applicable rule in Official Baseball Rules (I added the bold emphasis)-- OBR rule 5.09(b) Any runner is out when…: OBR rule 5.09(b)(6) He or the next base is tagged before he touches the next base, after he has been forced to advance by reason of the batter becoming a runner. However, if a following runner is put out on a force play, the force is removed and the runner must be tagged to be put out. The force is removed as soon as the runner touches the base to which he is forced to advance, and if he overslides or overruns the base, the runner must be tagged to be put out. However, if the forced runner, after touching the next base, retreats for any reason towards the base he had last occupied, the force play is reinstated, and he can again be put out if the defense tags the base to which he is forced; So, a runner is no longer forced (the force is removed) when— Such runner has touched or passed his advance base (if such runner is beyond his advance base he is out only when tagged off base). A trailing runner or the batter-runner is out. Exception: if a trailing runner is out for abandonment or desertion, the force is not removed against lead runners.
  10. Senor Azul

    Balk

    OBR rule 6.02 (a) Balks If there is a runner, or runners, it is a balk when…: (4) The pitcher, while touching his plate, throws, or feints a throw to an unoccupied base, except for the purpose of making a play; Rule 6.02 (a)(4) Comment: When determining whether the pitcher throws or feints a throw to an unoccupied base for the purpose of making a play, the umpire should consider whether a runner on the previous base demonstrates or otherwise creates an impression of his intent to advance to such unoccupied base. From the 2018 MiBUM (section 6.22, p. 104): Play 1: Runners on first and second, pitcher in set position. Runner breaks for third base and pitcher throws to third base. Ruling 1: Legal play. Play 2: Runners on first and second, pitcher in set position. Runner bluffs going to third base and pitcher throws to third base. However, runner did not go. Ruling 2: Balk under OBR 6.02(a)(4). “The key to understanding the above two plays is for the umpire to use good judgment in deciding whether or not the runner on the previous base demonstrates or otherwise creates an impression of his intent to advance to such unoccupied base.”
  11. Senor Azul

    Check swing walk turns into K/ Runner "out" stealing?

    Mr. buckyswider, you will get a more definitive and focused answer when you also provide the rule set used in the situation you describe. As it turns out, Mr. Jimurray is correct for both NCAA and OBR (this exact play is in all the manuals) and Mr. Richvee is correct for FED-- 2018 NFHS Case Book Play 10.2.3 Situation H: R1 with a count of 3-2 on B2, the batter takes what appears to be a half swing. The plate umpire calls ball four and R1, upon hearing ball four, then trots to second base. The catcher throws the ball to F4 who tags R1 before he reaches base. The catcher asks the plate umpire to check with the base umpire to see if B2 did, in fact, attempt to hit the pitch. The base umpire indicates that the batter did swing at the ball. RULING: The plate umpire will declare the batter out and return R1 to first base. The UIC can rectify any situation in which an umpire’s decision that was reversed has placed a base runner in jeopardy.
  12. Senor Azul

    More on throws deflected out of play

    Mr. maven could you give an actual cite for your assertion that “this question (TOP vs TOT) award turns on a distinct concept: impetus or force. . I have a copy of the 2015 MLBUM and in its section 17 (Balls Deflected Out of Play) appearing on pages 12-14 it says nothing like that. It seems to me that the concept most important to determining most base awards is whether the deflection was intentional or unintentional.
  13. Senor Azul

    What's the award?

    I posted the following text just 4 days ago. So, at least in FED, the terms seem to be used interchangeably. 2018 FED Case Book Play 8.3.3 Situation J: B1 singles to right field, (a) the ball rolls to a stop and F9, attempting to pick it up, kicks the ball into dead-ball territory or (b) the bouncing ball strikes F9 on the leg and deflects into dead-ball territory. RULING: In (a), F9 applied the impetus that caused the ball to go into dead-ball territory, which is the same as if he had thrown it there. The award to any runner is two bases from the base occupied at the time of the kick (throw). In (b), the force on the batted ball caused the ball to go into dead-ball territory, so the award to any runner is two bases from the base occupied at the time of the pitch.
  14. Senor Azul

    What's the award?

    The following text can be found in the PBUC manual, the MLBUM, and the MiBUM-- If a fair ball not in flight is deflected by a fielder and then goes out of play, the award is two bases from the time of the pitch. If a fielder has complete possession of a batted or thrown ball and subsequently deflects or kicks the ball out of play, the award is two bases from the position of the runners at the time the ball was kicked or deflected. If a fielder has complete possession of a batted or thrown ball and drops the ball and it then goes out of play, the award is two bases from the position of the runners at the time the ball was dropped. If, in the judgment of the umpires, a fielder intentionally kicks or deflects a batted or thrown ball out of play, the award is two bases from the time the ball was kicked or deflected.
  15. Senor Azul

    Force play slide INT video

    2018 FED Case Book Play 2.32.1 SITUATION: With R1, a ground ball is hit to F6, who throws to F4 covering second. R1 slides late at second, stays in the baseline, but R1 makes contact with F4 who is in front of the base, causing him to overthrow first base. RULING: Providing the slide is legal and the contact is not malicious, there is no violation. 2018 FED Case Book Play 5.1.1 Situation O: With R1, a ground ball is hit to F6, who throws to F4 covering second. R1 slides late at second, stays in the baseline, but R1 makes contact with F4 in front of the base, causing him to overthrow first base. RULING: Providing the slide is legal and the contact is not malicious, there is no violation. (2-32-2f)
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