HBP or strike?

[Guest Catfishfan]

In a recent game I was coaching, an opposing player was HBP and awarded first base. However, he had started to swing, and the bat crossed the plate before he tried to avoid the pitch (and he did try) before he was struck by the pitch. Strikes supersede HBP, should he have been awarded first, or should it have been a strike?

[Tborze]

30 minutes ago, Guest Catfishfan said:

In a recent game I was coaching, an opposing player was HBP and awarded first base. However, he had started to swing, and the bat crossed the plate before he tried to avoid the pitch (and he did try) before he was struck by the pitch. Strikes supersede HBP, should he have been awarded first, or should it have been a strike?

I'm going with what was called on the field at the time!  

The bat crossing the plate has nothing to do with an attempt. Ex: batter squares to bunt. Pitch is inside and up. Batters bat is past the plate but ducks to avoid the pitch without an attempt and hits his hands. He's going to first. 

In your case, the batter could have checked, pulled back, and then got hit. It's how you saw it.

Sometimes, we are right!

[Richvee]

If a batter is hit by a pitch when swinging, time is called, and a strike on the batter. No award of 1B.

In your case, did the umpire rule a swing? That's the key here. If it was check swing, and plate umpire said no swing, HBP,  you can ask him to ask his base umpire if he has a swing. If they  rule no swing, then  HBP, award 1B.

1 hour ago, Guest Catfishfan said:

should he have been awarded first, or should it have been a strike?

Can't answer without sing the "alleged" swing. And even then, it's judgment.

[ElkOil]

1 hour ago, Guest Catfishfan said:

should he have been awarded first, or should it have been a strike?

It was what the ump said it was. Since a strike/ball is a judgement call, the only way to answer your question is to say that since the umpire judged that the batter didn't swing, he was correct in awarding him 1B. We can't address his judgement here, just the rule interpretation, and he got it right.

[White47]

7 hours ago, Tborze said:

The bat crossing the plate has nothing to do with an attempt.

One of the oldest rule myths!! glad someone brought it up. 

 

good example of this it Will little's EJ last year. *turn off the sound, the broadcasters are dumb.

http://www.closecallsports.com/2016/09/mlb-ejection-189-will-little-4-pete.html#more

 

[Aging_Arbiter]

I gotta..............

Did the batter break his wrists??

[noumpere]

While I agree with all the answers above, let's be honest and admit that there are some umpires (especially, but not limited to, newer umpires) who don't know the rule and who *might* have said, "yes, it was a swing, but he got hit so I'm awarding first."

[stkjock]

small tangent question, I know it's a HTBT deal, if the batter spins in the box in his attempt to avoid an inside pitch (which he does avoid), he hands stay at his shoulder and arms tucked in, but in his effort to avoid the pitch the bat moves threw the zone, are you rulling a swing and strike?

[scrounge]

16 minutes ago, stkjock said:

small tangent question, I know it's a HTBT deal, if the batter spins in the box in his attempt to avoid an inside pitch (which he does avoid), he hands stay at his shoulder and arms tucked in, but in his effort to avoid the pitch the bat moves threw the zone, are you rulling a swing and strike?

If I think it was truly evasive action, I don't care where the bat goes, I'm not calling it a swing. If the batter started to swing and THEN spinned out? Well, then we have a more difficult decision. Did the swing rise to the level of an attempt to strike before the evasive action started? Was he bailing out of a bad swing or just tensing up a little and then ducking out? I know this isn't a terribly satisfactory answer, but I'd want to see if it's one action or two (an attempt and then bail).

[noumpere]

15 minutes ago, stkjock said:

small tangent question, I know it's a HTBT deal, if the batter spins in the box in his attempt to avoid an inside pitch (which he does avoid), he hands stay at his shoulder and arms tucked in, but in his effort to avoid the pitch the bat moves threw the zone, are you rulling a swing and strike?

Of course not.

[stkjock]

6 minutes ago, noumpere said:

Of course not.

TY

6 minutes ago, scrounge said:

If I think it was truly evasive action, I don't care where the bat goes, I'm not calling it a swing. If the batter started to swing and THEN spinned out? Well, then we have a more difficult decision. Did the swing rise to the level of an attempt to strike before the evasive action started? Was he bailing out of a bad swing or just tensing up a little and then ducking out? I know this isn't a terribly satisfactory answer, but I'd want to see if it's one action or two (an attempt and then bail).

It's a satisfactory answer   I know its a HTBT so including the extra detail is insightful, Thank you, I asked as I had this come up in a game recently, PU called a strike 3 on the swing, HC argued it was the batter attempting to avoid the the ball, both PU and BU called it a swing.  From my vantage, 1B side, about 15' from the box, it seemed to be totally evasive to me.