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VolUmp

All coaches in the dugout (bench).

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FED 3-3-1 i.

A coach, player, substitute, attendant or other bench personnel shall not be outside the designated dugout (bench) or bullpen area if not a batter, runner, on-deck batter, in the coach's box, or one of the nine players on defense.
PENALTY: The umpire shall warn the offender unless the offense is judged to be major, in which case an ejection shall occur.
Does anyone enforce this (when on defense) for Assistant Coaches? For Head Coaches?

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Yes, here we keep coaches in the dugout area. Often​ there will be an extension of the dugout that is out of play where coaches set up chairs.

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I'm confused. You allow defensive coaches in the playing area outside the dugout during play? Not here.

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48 minutes ago, Richvee said:

I'm confused. You allow defensive coaches in the playing area outside the dugout during play? Not here.

You're confused because you're assuming.

We do not allow assistants out of the dugouts while on defense ever.

We allow the Head Coach to sit just outside the dugout on a bucket and call pitches.

If it ever becomes a problem for any reason, we move them inside.

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No one outside the dugout here for HS games. Major POI the last few years. We even keep all personnel out of any openings in the  dugout/bench area. Everyone behind a fence. 

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Perhaps it's a major POI (Interest?) in your region, but not a POE in the FED book.  Not at all.

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Yes Emphasis. Not I.

39 minutes ago, Richvee said:

No one outside the dugout here for HS games.

"here" meaning "Here in NJ." Never said it's a POE in the FED book.

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In this, my first year of HS umpiring here in Arizona, I've noted there are three-to-four different styles (or layouts) of dugout. One particular style has marked extensions outside the confines of the dugout walls, fencing, and pavement, and within this DBT coaches may stand or sit upon buckets or chairs (as @KenBAZ mentioned).

There is another contrasting style of dugout which is basically a cage, completely fenced in, with an opening as the only unencumbered point. We usually allow the HC to direct his defense from this very abbreviated "porch", but to take up a position outside the dugout? Not really happening.

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We didn't use to mind having the occasional head coach outside a little bit, but the past couple years have seen a steadily increasing 'bucket brigade' and it started getting out of control. So now a POE in this region is to get them in and keep them in. Different umpires have varying degrees of adherence, but it's not a huge issue from what I've seen.

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I warned a bench for this over the weekend. With that, even the coach stayed in the dugout. It's not usually a problem here but generally we will tell them to stay within the confines of the dugout.

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21 hours ago, Richvee said:

Yes Emphasis. Not I.

"here" meaning "Here in NJ." Never said it's a POE in the FED book.

Major POI in NJ.  Although, most guys are not comfortable enforcing. Especially with the top coaches.

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22 hours ago, VolUmp said:

Perhaps it's a major POI (Interest?) in your region, but not a POE in the FED book.  Not at all.

Oh yes it is.  2017 Rules Book page 67 "Location of Team Personnel."

And I make it a point to mention it to both coaches during the plate meeting and enforce it during the game.

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5 minutes ago, ElkOil said:

Oh yes it is.  2017 Rules Book page 67 "Location of Team Personnel."

And I make it a point to mention it to both coaches during the plate meeting and enforce it during the game.

Thank you.  I stand extremely corrected.

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Not enforcing rules, especially when they are POE ... so you just leave it for the next guy?  Holy moly. 

 

Now I understand why some coaches complain that "we always do it this way, no one's ever said a thing..."

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Had this problem Saturday. It was labeled a POE here this year as well, even though its only been in the book since I started umpiring a decade ago.

The coach was relatively polite, varsity pitching coach at a JV game.

"I always sit here and you're the first person to ever say anything, do you do varsity and do that?"

Absolutely, I told him its not my problem that officials aren't enforcing the rules and thanked him for letting me know so I could relay that info to my organization.

Its a major problem here still, but jumping on it early in the game and addressing it at the plate meeting has helped a lot.

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This is something where your entire association must be on board or it doesn't really pay to do it b/c you'll look like a reda$$. 

If you are the only one in your group doing it, you'll struggle. Right or wrong that is the reality in most areas.

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We ran into this a bit a few years ago.  We had a team from our Chapter won the state title, and donations poured in. When they won it the next year, they had a new backstop constructed.  Well, when they set up the field again, the "original" dugouts are now about 75-100 feet behind the foul lines.  They initially tried to bring chairs up closer to the fence....we squashed it.  They then tried to set chairs up outside of the dugout......we squashed it.  When they asked what they COULD do, I heard one suggestion that was made to them was to expend some of those donations on new dugouts, closer to the field. 

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13 hours ago, BrianC14 said:

Not enforcing rules, especially when they are POE ... so you just leave it for the next guy?  Holy moly. 

 

Now I understand why some coaches complain that "we always do it this way, no one's ever said a thing..."

Consistency here -- and with this kind of thing in general -- is very important. It does not reflect well upon us as a whole or as a profession when we vary so much in what we enforce. Guys in our chapter pull their hair out each year when we emphasize this point. But there's always a few who for whatever reason, don't jump on board.

And yeah... it makes it that much harder for the rest of us.

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Absolutely no need for coaches to be outside the dugout. Period.

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