2013 ejection. My second of my career.

[tjwoelfel13]

I know I'm late to the party but I just joined a few days ago and this is my first post. So please be nice.

 

I am 18 and finished my third year as an umpire.

 

My league is a rec league starting at Kindergarten and goes up to 18 yrs.

 

 

The ejection occurred on Sept 15.

 

I usually work 3rd and 4th grade but was called down due to a lack of umpires. 

 

I had a Kindergarten game earlier that went without incident.

 

My league works the 2 man system and I noticed that one of my good friends was lacking a partner at a game with two coaches who are known troublemakers. So I hopped on before the game.

 

This was a second grade game which is a kid pitch game except when the pitchers issues a walk or hits a batter then the coach comes in and throws three pitches and if the batter fails to hit a fair ball in those 3 pitches he's out. There is also a coach who stands in front of the backstop to shag balls in order to keep the game going.

 

I'm the BU

 

The background info is finally over.

 

Here is my partners and my EJ report

 

Game time was supposed to be at 2:30pm. Because the previous game ran so close, game time was called at 2:35pm  James was originally was not scheduled to work with anyone for the 2:30pm game at Oregon Trail field 1.  TJ Woelfel offered to umpire with James since he did not have another game until 5:00pm that evening.  The first incident began when a coach was standing behind the backstop coaching his son who was pitching at the time.  TJ and I went over to the team and informed the gentleman (with the head coach easily able to hear) that he could not stand back behind the backstop while they were pitching.  As an added note, he was not the coach that usually stands behind the catcher to keep the game going.  The head coach was in that position.  The gentleman was behind it on the fans side of the fence.  To continue, the rest of that inning finished up and the team in question took the field again.  Again, the gentleman was behind the backstop on the fans side. After the pitch was thrown and returned, TJ called time and told the gentleman to move away from the backstop.  The head coach and the woman who is on the board for the league (she will be discussed later) made a little ruckus but the gentleman complied and the complaints were dropped without issue.  The team in question was still on the field when the main problem arose.  James was calling balls and strikes that game and the head coach of the team in question was shagging balls behind his catcher.  After his pitcher got through a batter throwing 4 balls, the coach started gesturing that the batter should have been struck out.  TJ noticed this and gave the head coach a warning saying "coach, that is enough."  Another batter came up and was walked.  The coach started making gestures in protest of the calls where upon TJ gave him Another warning  saying "coach, I've had enough."  The coach responded saying ""I have too."  I'd like to note at this time James had explained that his strike zone for fall ball to be about eyes to knees (or just below the knees) and inside of the white lines that denote the batters box.  The two kids that were walked and the following one that was walked all had about two balls that were on the edge of my extended strike zone but were in my opinion outside of it.  As a judgement call, James called these balls.  Another batter came up and was walked again.  At this point, the coach started shrugging his shoulders and making other gestures in objection to the calls.  TJ once again warned the head coach by saying "coach, I've had enough."  The coach responded again, "I have too" and stormed off the field.  Then, the woman, who later stated she is on the board called to us saying that we needed to call a timeout and talk about what was going on.  We weren't sure what we wanted to do at that point and came together.  We had called time at that point.  She again called for us to go over there and discuss the events that were transporting.  We decided to do so.  When we got over there, the head coach and the woman stepped onto the field.  The coach was upset with my strike zone and was saying that the ones James was calling to be balls were actually strikes.  He went as far to say "blue, I think that you have your eyes closed up there when you are making the calls."  That was enough for TJ  and TJ ejected the coach.  Then, the woman spoke up.  She said"I hope you two know that since a red hat is not present and I am on the board, I am your acting supervisor.  I am upset with your conduct during this game.  She then stated that "we've had incidents with you before and I've had enough."  She first started laying into us saying that the gentleman from earlier was a fan and not a coach so he could sit in the bleachers and coach the kids. We responded by saying he told us he was a coach, which is why we told him to move.  She said that for some games he fills in as a coach, but he is also a parent.  We told he we just went off what he told us.  Then, she proceeded to tell us she was going to contact the head of umpire commissioners and see that we would not be umpiring again.  After that, we ended the talk with her and resumed the game since we still had about 10 - 15 minutes left.  Their team was still in the field and we would like to add, despite the confrontation, James resolved and proceeded not to change my strike zone throughout the game for both teams.  We finished the game without further incident and ended by hitting the time limit.  After the game ended, we returned the game balls to the home team and we left immediately. 

 

After the game I went to talk to the league commissioner and he said that all three of the coaches were out of line and was actually surprised that I didn't eject the woman as well. The league had my back and neither James or my job was in any danger.

[clawdad]

First, welcome to the board.  There is a wealth of knowledge on here, and I think joining shows you want to continue to learn the craft.

 

I know each league is different, and has their own ways, but for me:

 

       2nd Grade game + pitching & batting restrictions like you stated + coach shagging balls behind catcher = no umpire necessary.

 

I think the only time I would have an umpire out there for that level of ball would be for training new umpires positioning; and maybe not even then.  Too many big bodies on a small field.

 

Some suggestions (IMHO):

1.  Don't tell a coach where your strike zone is.  If you're going to, tell him it is what the rulebook states and leave it at that.

 

2.  I count 3 warnings in your EJ report.  For me, that is at least 1 (if not 2) too many warnings, especially arguing balls & strikes.

 

3.  If that woman was actually on the board and did that to me, I'm leaving.  I am assuming you are a volunteer, but they couldn't pay me enough to put up with that.

Since you decided to continue working the game, eject her too.  If she refuses to leave, send the teams to the dugouts and refuse to continue play until she goes.

 

4.  Don't EVER, EVER put in your EJ report that you thought the call your partner made was wrong, or that it should have been different "in your opinion".  If you want to discuss it between the 2 of you in a post-game, OK.  But only if he asks you how you thought his zone was.  If you did that to me, I wouldn't work with you again.  Plus, it doesn't add anything of substance to the report.  If anything, it may give the coach an avenue to have his EJ overturned by the board.

 

5.  Your report is all over the place.  You start, stop, interject something, then continue. It is also written like two people just added things as they went along. Keep it simple.

 

  - You and James were the crew for the 2:30 p.m. game at Oregon Trail Field #1

  - During the game the following incidents occurred:

      * A gentleman was warned twice that he could no be behind the backstop.  He complied and moved each time.

     * In both the 1st & 2nd inning, a warning was issued to Coach___________ about arguing balls and strikes.  

     * In the 3rd inning,  woman ________ approached and stated she was on the board and needed to speak with you.  Time was called, and you approached the board member.  At this time, Coach________ came over as well.  Coach __________ resumed arguing balls and strikes, at which time he was ejected from the game.  Woman __________ began berating and threatening you.  you calmly allowed woman ____________ to finish her rant, then resumed the game without further incident.  After the game, you filed this EJ report with the appropriate people.

 

 

Again, welcome.  I hope the site helps you become a better umpire.  Everyone should continue to learn new things as they go along in their career.

[Mr Umpire]

Yeah, the report is TOO LONG.  TOO MUCH INFO.  TOO MUCH NON-IMPORTANT INFO. 

 

TOO MANY WARNINGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  1 and done.  That's it.  Any more and they will continue.  I know b/c I dealt with that my last weekend this year of umpiring.  PU gave "I don't want to hear another word" 3 times and the coach gave a remark back "You already said that".  He finally ejected the coach and I rodeoed him off the field when my partner did his job finally.

 

As stated, no need to tell where your strike zone is or your partner's.  I'm a little confused over who was calling balls/strikes based on this report.  No need to tell you agreed or disagreed with the call.  The report should only have facts in it, not opinions.  Nobody cares about your opinion in the report.  You can give that verbally if asked.  Also, no one wants to know if you had plans for Saturday night and gave them up to umpire a game.  Anything prior to or after the incident are not important unless related directly to the incident.

 

Also, I fail to see where the EJ is.  Was it when the coach voluntarily left the field?  And, why be concerned with what is going on outside the fence?  Leave it alone.  If he attempts to go in the dugout as a coach, inform him then he is either a coach or a fan.  Not both though many parks are liberal with this and I would not go looking for trouble.  This is minor and should be left alone.

 

Plus, unless she is invokes some kind of league board rule or authority to stop the game, I wouldn't stop it to talk to her.  She can wait until the game is over.  As far as you are concerned, she is just some fan who wants to be obnoxious and a jerk to throw her weight around.  She means nothing unless given some authority to do what she did.  Next time, tell her to wait until the game is over to discuss politics.

[mjr_2013]

First off, welcome! Judging by this post as well as your others, you know a lot more about umpiring than most, especially at such a young age. You'll find many others here (including myself) are of the same or younger age. This message board can be a great place to hone your craft, and you can learn just as much by lurking and reading as you can from posting.

 

As far as this situation goes, I think you and your partner handled it well. It could have been better, but these situations would make some breakdown. The fact that you and your partner kept your composure and were able to finish the game speaks volumes. 

 

As others have said, don't warn repeatedly. It makes your word mean less and less each time. If you say "Coach, I've had enough" or "That's enough" three times, is he going to believe that it's actually enough? No, he's just going to keep pushing. One warning, then toss... And I would have probably tossed when the coach said "I have too!" because at that point you're just complying with his wish.

 

That woman would probably piss me off to be honest. When she tells me she's on the board, I'd probably become a smart ass and tell her, "Do I come to board meetings and tell you how to do your job?" and when she continued, toss her. I wouldn't restart the game until she left either. A board is supposed to be on your side, and in this case if she wasn't helping, she was hurting.

 

Good luck and have fun!!

[th3]

 The two kids that were walked and the following one that was walked all had about two balls that were on the edge of my extended strike zone but were in my opinion outside of it. 

 

I don't think this says that his partner's calls were wrong

[grayhawk]

 

I know each league is different, and has their own ways, but for me:

 

       2nd Grade game + pitching & batting restrictions like you stated + coach shagging balls behind catcher = no umpire necessary.

 

 

^^^^^^^^^THIS!

[catcher]

My area has umpires starting in 3rd grade. The 3rd grade coaches are by far the worst. Bad baseball, entitled kids, and bipolar coaches = two hours of my life I'll never get back.

[Stan W.]

As an officer of my association, I am often asked at complexes where my association does games, why we do not do the younger age levels............the parents, the daddy coaches, entitled players, and bad baseball.......all come  to mind.....

[tjwoelfel13]

James was working the plate. I was on the bases. James was the one who wrote.  "The two kids that were walked and the following one that was walked all had about two balls that were on the edge of my extended strike zone but were in my opinion outside of it". He was trying to describe the location of the pitch.  I ejd the AC who was shagging balls who was arguing the ball/strikes. 

[mjr_2013]

As someone who got their start in umpiring at the age of 13 working rec tee ball games, I disagree that the young youth games should not have umpires. I think that, when the operation is well run, and with good support, young teenagers (younger than TJ) can learn a lot about baseball, and can get valuable life lessons. I feel that a lot of good umpires may never have become umpires if not for a lowly P&R to take them on as an young official.

 

Now, the situation and environment TJ describes is anything but a well run operation, in that game at least. If that is the league norm, I wouldn't want umpires of any age on any game below 10U, maybe even 12U

 

But tee ball and young baseball umpires are useful

[grayhawk]

As someone who got their start in umpiring at the age of 13 working rec tee ball games, I disagree that the young youth games should not have umpires. I think that, when the operation is well run, and with good support, young teenagers (younger than TJ) can learn a lot about baseball, and can get valuable life lessons. I feel that a lot of good umpires may never have become umpires if not for a lowly P&R to take them on as an young official.

 

Now, the situation and environment TJ describes is anything but a well run operation, in that game at least. If that is the league norm, I wouldn't want umpires of any age on any game below 10U, maybe even 12U

 

But tee ball and young baseball umpires are useful

 

You make it sound like they have umpires at these games for the benefit of the umpires.  Coach pitch and below is not a competition.  Parents sign their kids up for a combination of instruction, exercise and baby sitting.  There is no aspect of these games that require the presence of an unbiased official.  If they keep score, they're doing it wrong.

 

For youth umpires, there are plenty of opportunities to work games at the 9U level where the kids pitch, and coaches are only allowed on the field in the 1st and 3rd base coaches boxes.  Save the tee ball and coach pitch games for @JaxRolo.

[mjr_2013]

 

As someone who got their start in umpiring at the age of 13 working rec tee ball games, I disagree that the young youth games should not have umpires. I think that, when the operation is well run, and with good support, young teenagers (younger than TJ) can learn a lot about baseball, and can get valuable life lessons. I feel that a lot of good umpires may never have become umpires if not for a lowly P&R to take them on as an young official.

 

Now, the situation and environment TJ describes is anything but a well run operation, in that game at least. If that is the league norm, I wouldn't want umpires of any age on any game below 10U, maybe even 12U

 

But tee ball and young baseball umpires are useful

 

You make it sound like they have umpires at these games for the benefit of the umpires.  Coach pitch and below is not a competition.  Parents sign their kids up for a combination of instruction, exercise and baby sitting.  There is no aspect of these games that require the presence of an unbiased official.  If they keep score, they're doing it wrong.

 

For youth umpires, there are plenty of opportunities to work games at the 9U level where the kids pitch, and coaches are only allowed on the field in the 1st and 3rd base coaches boxes.  Save the tee ball and coach pitch games for @JaxRolo.

 

 

 

 

As someone who got their start in umpiring at the age of 13 working rec tee ball games, I disagree that the young youth games should not have umpires. I think that, when the operation is well run, and with good support, young teenagers (younger than TJ) can learn a lot about baseball, and can get valuable life lessons. I feel that a lot of good umpires may never have become umpires if not for a lowly P&R to take them on as an young official.

 

Now, the situation and environment TJ describes is anything but a well run operation, in that game at least. If that is the league norm, I wouldn't want umpires of any age on any game below 10U, maybe even 12U

 

But tee ball and young baseball umpires are useful

 

You make it sound like they have umpires at these games for the benefit of the umpires.  Coach pitch and below is not a competition.  Parents sign their kids up for a combination of instruction, exercise and baby sitting.  There is no aspect of these games that require the presence of an unbiased official.  If they keep score, they're doing it wrong.

 

For youth umpires, there are plenty of opportunities to work games at the 9U level where the kids pitch, and coaches are only allowed on the field in the 1st and 3rd base coaches boxes.  Save the tee ball and coach pitch games for @JaxRolo.

 

 

Helping the umpire may not be the league's intention, but it does happen... If they want to pay them, what's the harm? At the very least (in a good environment) it helps the kids recognize who an umpire is and what his job is... My league doesn't keep score in coach pitch or tee ball, but still has an umpire there. 

[TheGeneral]

On the Oregon Trail and nobody died of dysentery?

[tjwoelfel13]

Not that I'm aware of. 

 

On the Oregon Trail and nobody died of dysentery?

[tjwoelfel13]

Usually my league is a pretty quiet one and not too many incidents like this occur. The board members except for the one mentioned in the report usually have the umpires back.

[Platejob29]

Welcome to the forum, as you have already heard there is a wealth of information on here that can really help you to become a better umpire. Keep in mind though that everybody has their own opinions and that some will hold more water than others. Use your best judgment on what info you take with you onto the field and what info you don't. I'm not saying that the guys on here will post some suggestions that are wrong just that what works for some may not work for others and you have to choose what works best for you. 

 

I'll also add that it is awesome to have another young member on the site. There are a few of us on here but not a ton. 

[Thunderheads]

the fact that coaches at this level are complaining about 'balls and strikes' is the most pathetic thing about all of this!!

[tjwoelfel13]

the fact that coaches at this level are complaining about 'balls and strikes' is the most pathetic thing about all of this!!

 

 

The boardwoman took it to the league and I heard later that she was the only one who voted to overturn the ejection. Ejection stood and the coach was given his obligatory one game suspension. She sent me an apology afterwards and the league says that a boardperson who is coaching can't use their power as a board member to overturn a call on the field.

 

She was not punished though.

[Mr Umpire]

 

the fact that coaches at this level are complaining about 'balls and strikes' is the most pathetic thing about all of this!!

 

 

The boardwoman took it to the league and I heard later that she was the only one who voted to overturn the ejection. Ejection stood and the coach was given his obligatory one game suspension. She sent me an apology afterwards and the league says that a boardperson who is coaching can't use their power as a board member to overturn a call on the field.

 

She was not punished though.

 

She was a coach?  I would have told her she is no different than any other AC, board member or not.  I am not discussing the calls with her, only the HC.  If she persists, she gets EJ as well.

 

It sounds like you are in hell in this league.  They don't need umpires.  They need babysitters to watch the adults while the kids play the game.

[mjr_2013]

If the board member is an AC, I'm not even walking to her. She may be a board member off the field, but when I step on the field she is no different than any other coach. She has virtually no power in the realm of the game.

 

Was the apology sincere, or was it just her being PC? Hopefully the league remembers this the next time it's time to vote

[tjwoelfel13]

 I think that her apology was forced but sincere. I had her team again and she kept her mouth shut. This may have been because she learned that I wasn't going to put up with her nonsense again.  " Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me".

 

I think she was used to dealing with the first years who are trying to get established and they cowered beneath her "power". I'm thinking she used this fear to try to intimidate the rookie umpires into allowing her coaching staff to get away with anything they wanted because the rookies thought that they would get fired.  But in the op she got me and James. We just finished our third and fourth year respectively and knew more about the leagues inner workings enough to not change our calls.  

 

 

. Now that I think about it I probably would've had her come to me instead of me going to her because I think that may have given her the thought of even more added power. 

 

I went to one of my supervisors after the game and his reaction was like this.  "SHE DID WHAT"?    !?!? :hopmad:   :tantrum:

 

 My league has three main umpire supervisors and all three had our back.

[clawdad]

James was working the plate. I was on the bases. James was the one who wrote.  "The two kids that were walked and the following one that was walked all had about two balls that were on the edge of my extended strike zone but were in my opinion outside of it". He was trying to describe the location of the pitch.  I ejd the AC who was shagging balls who was arguing the ball/strikes. 

Gotcha.  That's why I said what I did about your report - it was confusing.   Each of you do your own report, but make sure they tell the same story.  Personally, I wouldn't put the stuff about "my extended strike zone" in there.

 

 

 

the fact that coaches at this level are complaining about 'balls and strikes' is the most pathetic thing about all of this!!

 

 

The boardwoman took it to the league and I heard later that she was the only one who voted to overturn the ejection. Ejection stood and the coach was given his obligatory one game suspension. She sent me an apology afterwards and the league says that a boardperson who is coaching can't use their power as a board member to overturn a call on the field.

 

She was not punished though.

 

A boardperson who ISN'T coaching can't use their power to overturn a call on the field.  The game is yours to officiate, and you make calls.  The coaches can protest a misapplication of the rules if they wish, and a call may get changed after the protest is heard.

 

I wish I could get some kids around here to start umpiring young like you.  Kudos to you.  I hope you stay with it.

[mjr_2013]

 I think that her apology was forced but sincere. I had her team again and she kept her mouth shut. This may have been because she learned that I wasn't going to put up with her nonsense again.  " Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me".

 

I think she was used to dealing with the first years who are trying to get established and they cowered beneath her "power". I'm thinking she used this fear to try to intimidate the rookie umpires into allowing her coaching staff to get away with anything they wanted because the rookies thought that they would get fired.  But in the op she got me and James. We just finished our third and fourth year respectively and knew more about the leagues inner workings enough to not change our calls.  

 

 

. Now that I think about it I probably would've had her come to me instead of me going to her because I think that may have given her the thought of even more added power. 

 

I went to one of my supervisors after the game and his reaction was like this.  "SHE DID WHAT"?    !?!? :hopmad:   :tantrum:

 

 My league has three main umpire supervisors and all three had our back.

 

That's my BIGGEST pet peeve by far… When I was 14, I was umpiring a 6 year old's softball game. I had only umpired like five games in my life prior. I called a strike on a pitch that probably (in hindsight) was a ball, but honestly it's 6YO softball, who gives a crap… Well, a 300 lb. bodybuilder 1st base coach intimidated me into changing my call. After the game, I felt like crap and almost cried. He legitimately scared me and I was ready to never go back to umpiring for a time.

 

As the new UIC of my league, that is one thing I will NOT stand for from coaches. Good for you for standing up to her.

[ricka56]

I am 18 and finished my third year as an umpire.

 

That's my BIGGEST pet peeve by far… When I was 14, I was umpiring a 6 year old's softball game. I had only umpired like five games in my life prior. I called a strike on a pitch that probably (in hindsight) was a ball, but honestly it's 6YO softball, who gives a crap… Well, a 300 lb. bodybuilder 1st base coach intimidated me into changing my call. After the game, I felt like crap and almost cried. He legitimately scared me and I was ready to never go back to umpiring for a time.

 

As the new UIC of my league, that is one thing I will NOT stand for from coaches. Good for you for standing up to her.

I coached my kids until they were too old for daddy coaching, Then I became an umpire at age 48. I never had to put up with these daddy coach/bullies as a minor. It really is too bad that y'all didn't have rational adults having your backs at gametime.

 

I can't fathom what it must be like to be a minor and have these bullies in your face. It's east for us seasoned umpires to tell you to not take that crap, but it's got to be incredibly hard not to throw in the towel and tell them'all to Fv@& off. But if you can stand your ground and refuse to put up with inappropriate adult behavior, you will come out of better men/women in the lomg run (not just better umpires). ..I'll be rooting for y'all.

[mjr_2013]

 

I am 18 and finished my third year as an umpire.

 

That's my BIGGEST pet peeve by far… When I was 14, I was umpiring a 6 year old's softball game. I had only umpired like five games in my life prior. I called a strike on a pitch that probably (in hindsight) was a ball, but honestly it's 6YO softball, who gives a crap… Well, a 300 lb. bodybuilder 1st base coach intimidated me into changing my call. After the game, I felt like crap and almost cried. He legitimately scared me and I was ready to never go back to umpiring for a time.

 

As the new UIC of my league, that is one thing I will NOT stand for from coaches. Good for you for standing up to her.

I coached my kids until they were too old for daddy coaching, Then I became an umpire at age 48. I never had to put up with these daddy coach/bullies as a minor. It really is too bad that y'all didn't have rational adults having your backs at gametime.

 

I can't fathom what it must be like to be a minor and have these bullies in your face. It's east for us seasoned umpires to tell you to not take that crap, but it's got to be incredibly hard not to throw in the towel and tell them'all to Fv@& off. But if you can stand your ground and refuse to put up with inappropriate adult behavior, you will come out of better men/women in the lomg run (not just better umpires). ..I'll be rooting for y'all.

 

What I wrote was probably the hardest point, but I think that the experiences, knowledge, and fun I've gained heavily outweighs the unfortunate experiences in my first five years of umpiring (started when I was 13, am 18 now)… I absolutely agree that I've come out a better person by learning how to deal with it.

 

I remember my mom commenting at a game she went to: "How do you put up with these assholes??" I laughed.

 

I can only hope that my tenure as UIC of this league will help these kids become better men and women, and that I can do my best to prevent the unfortunate incidences, or at the very least show the youth's that they are better than that bully.